Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going start with a really easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I think we all found, as leaders, no matter what company were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we flexible as a team? How do we communicate in time and keep people informed as we try and through things? And then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over last few years is we each experience the world so differently. We employees who are remote. We have an incredible team Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who are literally war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, so I think it was really just — the hardest part was not able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more flexible nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you an example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, enhance communications or build trust or create a greater of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a of things that we did. One — and we are a platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous messages. So I send … I record my screen and just send a note out to people. Every new does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the context to through and I think that helped us a lot to, of, stay close. So that was one, I think, important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so one of the things we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in all of town halls, we do it in a lot of — is always talk about what’s working, what are top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma from talking about what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about what do we to change, what do we need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love advice about being video-first. So many of our members of our workforce live in video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. Which brings to my next question. You’ve talked about how the has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of things that we think about at Vimeo a lot a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They designed for a totally different environment and a totally generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, think, is the line between your personal life and work is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal — look at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, a very specific way. And if they then have to to work and to be trained on a job, read 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s not going to happen. And so I think that is definitely sort of this — you know, we about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy for saying the way … we communicate and interact in personal lives is going to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other I see from sort of the generation, the newest generation into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My told me that this is what we’re going to do” — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority them to do it. They want to do it because understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I think that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are of the things I see, and then, you know, the I think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of all of us, but particularly younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and be committed to things, but also know to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, you share a few examples of ways that you at have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, things like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way have for our users, for our internal teams. But I would say one the things that we’ve really tried to do is that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try and out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you — when you really dig into it and truly listen and do focus and talk to people — what you’ll find is there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I will you, some of the things that we’ve heard from employees changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, not treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s particularly stark because we have offices and teams in many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we used to have a very, of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and what we found we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the world around them quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it involved a lot of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s a lot of trying things, it not working, and them. And a great example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader know has a perspective on whether they do open and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know we will again, we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and have a dialogue with very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear from of my generation and older is a concern about making sure that we are not providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the that they need, but also the training and the that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for many years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will of have a solution for. I think about that the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the of being able to have a distributed workforce and being to attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of up the executive team almost entirely in the last months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an system, as an executive team, for how we’re going to together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do create the right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be to do it ourselves and model it and then, think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. will say, like many companies … I do believe in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we bring into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time in room with their team, do social activities, all of things. I don’t think they will go away, nor I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, do that, so that this next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities that we had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard a number of organizations that have really encouraged their young to present, as a way of having to go out and find the information need. And then, because we have video tools available to now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their with a large group of people, but first, kind going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and different things that people are bringing to work, whether is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we a lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader to empower people to do their best work and the responsibility of a company to empower our people to do their best work. so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, the way we probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the right in place who care. At the same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach actually the root cause — that we can control Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking to do too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should be spending more — is how do we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t feel to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What the detail there, and do we need to do differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software a service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — and it hasn’t — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I think what I observed the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did things maybe it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, you know, sort of see it as — the way you how you are caring towards your employees and how you empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And you to believe that. You have to be committed to that and you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how you been taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance you need be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use lot to myself is “two things can be true, both can true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things that happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I have find joy in my team. I feel like, especially hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have a great support network around and I do … My husband and I have a deal, on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. just disappear and I walk around the city and I listen to my music do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how work is going to look very different in the future how we describe it today. It’s basically in office couple of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us a bit more about what you could potentially see that into.
AS: I think the idea of an office a time and place completely goes away. And I it’s really going to be people are going to want work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the of where you’re located is going to change. And the idea of like “I’m going to work on time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I think you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration happen asynchronously and we will be using tools and technology — it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think the skill set to be a global CEO 30 ago versus what that will require now — I think in the future … the skill set is going be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place or budget, in some cases. And I those constraints are going to go away. And the promise that if we are flexible and smart and we use technology the right way, that we’ll actually come away a much more evolved and workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank so much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This great.