Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, have technologists. So I’m going to start with a really question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce through global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant been change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. I think what we all found, as leaders, no what company you were … responsible for, was that couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and things around you. And so, you know, for me, it was about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do communicate in real time and keep people informed as we try and move through things? then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve learned over the last few years is we each the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We an incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who literally at war. On the other hand, you have people different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health or burnout, and so I think it was really just — hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, a company, to build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging this time with a culture that is more flexible nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that you into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build or create a greater sense of community or even to communicate that there no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that did. One — and we are a video platform, I obviously have to talk about video, but I this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. I send … I record my screen and just send a note out to people. new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and context to come through and I think that helped us a lot to, of, stay close. So that was one, I think, really thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an area isn’t working. And so one of the things that do at Vimeo is we try — I do this all of my town halls, we do it in a lot meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be open, as an organization, about what do we need change, what do we need to pivot. And both those, being more video-first in our communication and being more and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: love that advice about being video-first. So many of our of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about the organization has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we think at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a of differences. One of them, I think, is the line between your personal and work life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal — look at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And they then have to come to work and to trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not to happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives going to translate to work. And so I definitely that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And think there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this is what we’re to do” or — that, I think, is increasingly away, and people, they don’t just want to do because someone with formal authority told them to do it. want to do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. I think that that forces leaders to really bring more the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So are two of the things I see, and then, you know, the I think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of all of us, but the younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and committed to things, but also know when to question, and when actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that you at have tried to really be proactive when it comes addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees are going to want, either terms of purpose or in terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there or processes you’ve put in place that really speak to this big sea change we’re in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, things like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way have for our users, for our internal teams. But I would say one of the things we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try and pull an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because you actually — when you really dig into it and truly listen and do focus and talk to people — what you’ll find is there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. I think it’s more just like I said, that listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s particularly stark because we have offices and teams in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we used have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the of consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms support our teams in a very different way, because their and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely one, and I will tell you, it has involved lot of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s a lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example our Q and A. I feel like every leader I has a perspective on whether they do open Q A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way listen and have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making that we are not just providing our youngest employees with the and the purpose that they need, but also the and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job many more years. What is your philosophy and take on sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone sort of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, an executive team, for how we’re going to work together that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How we create the right communication loops? And so I think, from perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it ourselves and model and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism young people. I will say, like many companies … do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. do have — we bring people into an office. If you’re remote, ask folks to come in and spend time in room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really critical that leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to get the growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be really there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that really encouraged their young people to present, as a of having to go out and find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a large of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked little bit about mental illness and the different things that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you share a little bit about how you deal with increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader is to empower people to do best work and the responsibility of a company is empower our people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a real role play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, know, the way I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s important. And I always say, to so many of managers … just care. If we just care, a lot things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if just have the right people in place who care. At same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, sort of this next phase, is that that’s a approach and actually the root cause — that we can at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, is actually we should be spending more time — is how do actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, so we already went from “growth all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results and treat people well. I actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of it as — the way you channel how you caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, should be in service of helping people do their work, which will deliver results, which will be good the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You you just had a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, phrase I use a lot to myself is “two can be true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. And me, I think of it as, like, “This job hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of the and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a in Ukraine going through a war — all these that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I to have passion. I have to have passion. I to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then will — I can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s it brought a group of people together all on team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think have a great support network around me and I do … My husband and I a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I disappear and I walk around the city and I listen to my music and do I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you about how hybrid work is going to look very different in the future how we describe it today. It’s basically in office a of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us little bit more about what you could potentially see evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a time place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going to want work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept where you’re located is going to change. And then idea of like “I’m going to work on this zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I think what you’re going find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will asynchronously and we will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if think about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 ago versus what that will require now — I in the future … the skill set is going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place or budget, in cases. And I think those constraints are going to go away. And the is that if we are flexible and smart and use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.