Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with really easy question: what was it like to manage this workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. know, I think the only constant has been change. as a leader, you obviously — you have a that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. And so, you know, me, it was really about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do we in real time and keep people informed as we try and move things? And then, also just how do we lead more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the few years is we each experience the world so differently. have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees are on the front lines, who are literally at war. On other hand, you have people in different parts of the world who experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it was really just — the hardest part not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. One — and are a video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And did make a concerted effort to move away from email chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent video messages. So I send … I record my screen just send a note out to people. Every new hire a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really was allow the humanity and the context to come through I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an that isn’t working. And so one of the things that we do at is we try — I do this in all of my town halls, do it in a lot of meetings — is talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, do we need to pivot. And both of those, more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. many of our members of our workforce live in video world. They’re used to video as a means communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked how the organization has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What is different with young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot the mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, the line between your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … If think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then to come to work and to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording of three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that there definitely sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate interact in our personal lives is going to translate work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority told to do it. They want to do it because they understand it matters, why it ties to the mission. And think that that forces leaders to really bring more the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the things see, and then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try orient it more to agility. How can we have approaches and and be committed to things, but also know when to question, when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it to addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees going to want, either in terms of purpose or terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are programs or processes you’ve put in place that really speak to big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same we have for our users, for our internal teams. But would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t at it all in totality and try and pull an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you — when you really dig into it and truly listen and do focus groups and to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried to do have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from employees have our approach to hybrid work or travel or even like our approach to compensation or our approach to and I. So I think it’s more just like said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, the way we solve different things. And we used have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and what found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms to our teams in a very different way, because their and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, I will tell you, it has involved a lot of — as executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example our Q and A. I feel like every leader I know a perspective on whether they do open Q and A anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know will again, because we’re still figuring out the right to listen and have a dialogue with a very workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the workplace for another moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about sure that we are not just providing our youngest with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done job for many more years. What is your philosophy and take on making that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits being able to have a distributed workforce and being able attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling at the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, and development for a whole set of new executives have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in the twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. we’ve had to literally — we call it our system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? And I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it and model it and then, I think it’s a proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really for learning. We do have — we bring people an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. don’t think they will go away, nor do I think should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, that this next generation is able to get the same opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s — the tools that you mentioned at the very of our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a of organizations that have really encouraged their young people present, as a way of having to go out find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a large of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit mental illness and the different things that people are bringing work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, had a lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the of a leader is to empower people to do their best and the responsibility of a company is to empower our people to do their work. And so, of course, we have a real to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And always say, to so many of our managers … just care. we just care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the right in place who care. At the same time, I say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re people to do too many things or they don’t like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, is where we should be spending more time — is how do we set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What is detail there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, as a service, so we already went from “growth all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My on this — and it hasn’t changed — I the best leaders and cultures deliver results and treat well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I think I observed over the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of see it — the way you channel how you are caring towards employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And you have believe that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a lot on shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care how do you make sure that you’re getting the you need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, phrase I use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, both can be true.” say this a lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic and year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine through a war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s hard job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that Vimeo is doing is important and matters for the world. And if I have passion, have energy and then I will — I can of move through anything. I have to find joy my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, look back at my career and actually, some of my fulfilling times in work were when — in the business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people all on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think have a great support network around me and I do … My husband and have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear I walk around the city and I listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work is going look very different in the future than how we describe today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more about what could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think idea of an office as a time and place goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of where you’re located is going change. And then the idea of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going go away. And I think what you’re going to is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be using tools technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, are going to look different. Because I think it’s to require — if you think about the skill set to be global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require now — I in the future … the skill set is going to like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and across time zones in a way that is effective, provides context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether was time or place or budget, in some cases. And think those constraints are going to go away. And the is that if we are flexible and smart and we use technology in right way, that we’ll actually come away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, think you just showed us some of the passion you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.