Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, have technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: what was it like to this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, I think only constant has been change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things you. And so, you know, for me, it was really agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in real time and keep informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just how do we lead with humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the few years is we each experience the world so differently. have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are on front lines, who are literally at war. On the hand, you have people in different parts of the who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so think it was really just — the hardest part was being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications build trust or create a greater sense of community or even to communicate that there no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. One — we are a video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did a concerted effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent video messages. So I send … I record my screen just send a note out to people. Every new does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow humanity and the context to come through and I that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about things aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile is we have an area that isn’t working. And so one the things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do in all of my town halls, we do it in a lot meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve of created, I think, a framework that sort of the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to more open, as an organization, about what do we need change, what do we need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used video as a means of communication. Which brings me my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How do you see workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things we think about at Vimeo a lot is a of the mechanisms and communication modes that we still today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment and totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, think, is the line between your personal life and life is definitely blending. … If you think about your life — look at TikTok. This generation is used to content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they have to come to work and to be trained on a job, read 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that there is sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” are just fancy words for saying the way … we and interact in our personal lives is going to translate work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. one of our communication mantras is we never talk the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do something because someone with formal told them to do it. They want to do it because they understand why it matters, why ties to the mission. And I think that that forces leaders really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I and orient it more to agility. How can we have and principles and be committed to things, but also know to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding your next generation of employees are going to want, in terms of purpose or in terms of benefits in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, promoter score, the same way we have for our users, our internal teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve really to do is appreciate that when we get inputs our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look it all in totality and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, this how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when really dig into it and truly listen and do focus groups talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I for us, what we’ve really just tried to do have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of it out, but I will tell you, some of the things we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach to hybrid or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, not treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been stark because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about way we solve different things. And we used to have very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of and fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms to our teams in a very different way, because their experiences the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s been one, and I will tell you, it has involved lot of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader know has a perspective on whether they do open Q A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our there multiple times, and I know we will again, we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and have a dialogue with a diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure we are not just providing our youngest employees with flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, being in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job many more years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure that knowledge transfer happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that will sort of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, think, a lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, how we’re going to work together in that environment. do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to able to do it ourselves and model it and then, I it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. do have — we bring people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to in and spend time in a room with their team, do social activities, all those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor do I think should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next is able to get the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at the beginning of our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve of a number of organizations that have really encouraged their young people to present, a way of having to go out and find the information need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, you know, they an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, talked a little bit about mental illness and the different things that people are to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share little bit about how you deal with this increasing — you know, when people bring their whole selves to the office, which encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader is to empower people do their best work and the responsibility of a is to empower our people to do their best work. And so, of course, have a real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, the way we initially sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the people in place who care. At the same time, I say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root — that we can control at Vimeo — the cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re people to do too many things or they don’t feel like they’re in doing those things. And that, I think, is where we should be spending more time — is do we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you that there are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, work in SAS, software as a service, so we already from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. so, you know, for me, I think what I over the last few years is — that part, think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service or felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of it as — the way you channel how you are caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, should be in service of helping people do their work, which will deliver results, which will be good for bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to committed to that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you sure that you’re getting the balance you need to be the most leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use lot to myself is “two things can be true, can be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, think of it as, like, “This job is hard, it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, have a team in Ukraine going through a war — these things that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and matters the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then I will — I can kind of through anything. I have to find joy in my team. I feel like, in hard times, I look back at my career and actually, of my most fulfilling times in work were when — in the hardest business situations. it’s because it brought a group of people together all one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. think I have a great support network around me and I do … My husband and I a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around city and I listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work is going to look different in the future than how we describe it today. It’s basically in office couple of days, work from home a couple of other days. us a little bit more about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: think the idea of an office as a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s going to be people are going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in world. Even the concept of where you’re located is to change. And then the idea of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — think that’s going to go away. And I think you’re going to find is more and more work, from knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration happen asynchronously and we will be using tools and technology — it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And I think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going require — if you think about the skill set to be a global 30 years ago versus what that will require now — think in the future … the skill set is going to like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All that is going to look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going to go away. And the is that if we are flexible and smart and we use technology in right way, that we’ll actually come away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, think you just showed us some of the passion that you’ve talked as being the thing that gives you energy to that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This great.