Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going start with a really easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was challenging. You know, I think the only constant has change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I what we all found, as leaders, no matter what you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t control the environment and the things around you. And so, you know, for me, it really about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do communicate in real time and keep people informed as we try and through things? And then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really over the last few years is we each experience the world so differently. We have employees are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees are on the front lines, who are literally at war. the other hand, you have people in different parts of the world are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it was really just — the part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, a company, to build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: you give an example of something that you put place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that is muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. One — and we a video platform, so I obviously have to talk video, but I mean this sincerely — one of hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away from and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands and your body your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … record my screen and just send a note out to people. Every new hire a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what really did was allow the humanity and the context come through and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so of the things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in of my town halls, we do it in a lot meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework sort of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. when you make that normalized and comfortable for people, feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, as organization, about what do we need to change, what we need to pivot. And both of those, being video-first in our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So many of our members of workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. Which brings me my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How do you see the changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, is the between your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … If you about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. if they then have to come to work and to be trained a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to watch Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort of — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of the generation, the generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one our communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want do something because someone with formal authority told them to it. They want to do it because they understand why matters, why it ties to the mission. And I think that that leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the things see, and then, you know, the third I think is flexibility. I think — and this is true of all of us, particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but is where I try and orient it more to agility. How we have approaches and principles and be committed to things, but know when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the things we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But I say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look the averages. You can’t look at it all in and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, this is everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into it truly listen and do focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll find actually there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I think for us, we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still of figuring it out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard employees have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things our approach to compensation or our approach to DE I. So I think it’s more just like I said, agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not everything as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because have offices and teams in so many different countries the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way solve different things. And we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to be localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the world them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it has a lot of — as an executive team and team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. a great example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader know has a perspective on whether they do open Q and or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and have dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the for just another moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is concern about making sure that we are not just our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job many more years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure that transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve to design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? And I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able do it ourselves and model it and then, I it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration really important for learning. We do have — we bring people into an office. If you’re remote, ask folks to come in and spend time in a with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they go away, nor do I think they should. But, know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really figured perfectly and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, do that, so that this next generation is able to get the growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having to out and find the information they need. And then, because have video tools available to us now, you know, they have an to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit about illness and the different things that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if can share a little bit about how you deal with this personal — you know, when people bring their whole to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought responsibility of a leader is to empower people to do their best work and responsibility of a company is to empower our people do their best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to do that more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I say, to so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you have the right people in place who care. At the same time, will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to too many things or they don’t feel like they’re in doing those things. And that, I think, is actually where we be spending more time — is how do we actually set the right prioritization focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get the “What is the detail there, and do we need do things differently?” And, you know, one of our at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I in SAS, software as a service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, me, I think what I observed over the last years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of it as — the way you channel how you are caring your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the line. And you have to believe that. You have be committed to that and if you use that in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting balance you need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the I use a lot to myself is “two things can true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things that happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is is important and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and I will — I can kind of move through anything. I have find joy in my team. I feel like, especially hard times, I look back at my career and actually, of my most fulfilling times in work were when — in the business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am fortunate. I think I have a great support network around me and I do … My and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear I walk around the city and I listen to my and do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: you talked about how hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than how we it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from home a couple of days. Tell us a little bit more about what you could potentially that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an as a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. the concept of where you’re located is going to change. then the idea of like “I’m going to work on this zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. And think what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen and we will be using tools and technology — it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to — if you think about the skill set to be a global 30 years ago versus what that will require now — I in the future … the skill set is going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, audiences and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are to go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart and we technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This great.