Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with a easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, I think only constant has been change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s around them. And I think what we all found, leaders, no matter what company you were … responsible for, was you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How we communicate in real time and keep people informed we try and move through things? And then, also how do we lead with more humanity? You know, Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the few years is we each experience the world so differently. We have employees are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are on the lines, who are literally at war. On the other hand, have people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, so I think it was really just — the hardest was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as company, to build more trust, because to be agile flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an of something that you put into place, perhaps during pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create greater sense of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that is a muscle you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple things that we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I have to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of the parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away from email chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I my screen and just send a note out to people. new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the context to come through I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. so one of the things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I this in all of my town halls, we do it in a lot of — is always talk about what’s working, what are top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma away from talking what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be open, as an organization, about what do we need change, what do we need to pivot. And both those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I that advice about being video-first. So many of our members of our live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one the things that we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot the mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work life is blending. … If you think about your personal life — at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very way. And if they then have to come to work and to be trained on job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s not going to happen. And so I think that there definitely sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the way … communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to translate work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is we never talk the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a desire — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is moving away, and people, they don’t just want to something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want to do because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And think that that forces leaders to really bring more the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the I see, and then, you know, the third I is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of all us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and it more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and be to things, but also know when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can share a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to really proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place that speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for our teams. But I would say one of the things we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t at the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try and pull an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because you actually — when you really dig into it truly listen and do focus groups and talk to — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and among your employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of it out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard employees have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things our approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many different and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve different things. we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global in the name of consistency and fairness, and what found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the world around them is different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I tell you, it has involved a lot of — an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And great example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader I has a perspective on whether they do open Q and or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and know we will again, because we’re still figuring out right way to listen and have a dialogue with a very workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure that we not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job many more years. What is your philosophy and take making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a for. I think about that all the time. We have a very distributed at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire team is distributed, that means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, and development for a whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort changed up the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, an executive team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. How we share real-time feedback? How do we create the communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more have to be able to do it ourselves and it and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — bring people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. don’t think they will go away, nor do I think should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a of organizations that have really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having to go and find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their with a large group of people, but first, kind of through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little about mental illness and the different things that people are bringing to work, whether is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives protests, we had a lot of people coming to office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you share a little bit about how you deal with increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves to office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the of a leader is to empower people to do their best work and responsibility of a company is to empower our people to do their work. And so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, the way we probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, to so of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms you just have the right people in place who care. At the same time, will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the cause — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported doing those things. And that, I think, is actually we should be spending more time — is how do we actually set the right and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped to it.” Then, we should get into the “What is the there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you that there are going to be stakeholders who say, know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, work in SAS, software as a service, so we went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, swing. My perspective on this — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I what I observed over the last few years is — part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, lot of times when companies, we did things because it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what need, in any case. So, you know, I sort see it as — the way you channel how you are towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do their work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how you been taking care of yourself during this period of turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance you need to be the most effective you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase use a lot to myself is “two things can true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I think it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a in Ukraine going through a war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s hard job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s have to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what is doing is important and matters for the world. And if have passion, I have energy and then I will — I can of move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. I feel like, in hard times, I look back at my career actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were when — in the hardest situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people together all one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big part it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, and care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have great support network around me and I do … My and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk the city and I listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work going to look very different in the future than how we describe today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from a couple of other days. Tell us a little more about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to people are going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the of where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s to go away. And I think what you’re going to find more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to — if you think about the skill set to be a CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require — I think in the future … the skill set is to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time place or budget, in some cases. And I think constraints are going to go away. And the promise is that if we are and smart and we use technology in the right way, we’ll actually come away a much more evolved and workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives energy to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being here today.
AS: you. This was great.