Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here with today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: what was it to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company you … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things you. And so, you know, for me, it was about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in time and keep people informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just how do lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the few years is we each experience the world so differently. We employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in … employees who are on the front lines, who are literally war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts of world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and I think it was really just — the hardest was not being able to give everyone certainty, not able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it us, as a company, to build more trust, because to agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can give an example of something that you put into place, during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or a greater sense of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that did. One — and we are a video platform, I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean this — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And did make a concerted effort to move away from email chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when we communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And did that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my screen and just a note out to people. Every new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really was allow the humanity and the context to come through and I think that us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have area that isn’t working. And so one of the that we do at Vimeo is we try — do this in all of my town halls, we do it in a lot of — is always talk about what’s working, what are our top things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about do we need to change, what do we need to pivot. both of those, being more video-first in our communication and more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love advice about being video-first. So many of our members of workforce live in a video world. They’re used to as a means of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What different with the young millennials, and even, now, the wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different and a totally different generation. But I see a of differences. One of them, I think, is the line between your personal and work life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then to come to work and to be trained on a job, read 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. so I think that there is definitely sort of this — know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for the way … we communicate and interact in our lives is going to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And of our communication mantras is we never talk about “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They to do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And think that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, know, the third I think is just flexibility. I — and this is true of all of us, particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and be to things, but also know when to question, and to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it to addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees are going want, either in terms of purpose or in terms benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs processes you’ve put in place that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of things that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same we have for our users, for our internal teams. But I would one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. can’t look at it all in totality and try and pull out an “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when really dig into it and truly listen and do groups and talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires your employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge to pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of it out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve from employees have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things our approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because have offices and teams in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we used to a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and what found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have design mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely one, and I will tell you, it has involved a of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. I like every leader I know has a perspective on they do open Q and A or anonymous Q A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to and have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern making sure that we are not just providing our youngest employees the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also the training and wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a mentor or to who’s done the job for many more years. What is your philosophy and on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have solution for. I think about that all the time. We have a distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and just be more inclusive. the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, we’re modeling it at the top. So if my executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, and development for a whole set of new executives have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in the twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve to literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve to design an operating system, as an executive team, how we’re going to work together in that environment. How we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? And so think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do ourselves and model it and then, I think it’s a proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. do have — we bring people into an office. you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and time in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really critical as leaders, we do that, so that this next is able to get the same growth opportunities that we had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of number of organizations that have really encouraged their young to present, as a way of having to go out and find the information need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, you know, they an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked little bit about mental illness and the different things people are bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, had a lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility a leader is to empower people to do their best work the responsibility of a company is to empower our people to do their best work. so, of course, we have a real role to in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, many companies, the way we initially probably sought to that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. think that’s really important. And I always say, to so of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you have the right people in place who care. At the same time, will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking to do too many things or they don’t feel they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, actually where we should be spending more time — how do we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, should get into the “What is the detail there, and we need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. think the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get results. And so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot times when companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, any case. So, you know, I sort of see it — the way you channel how you are caring towards employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if you use that consistently your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do practice some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the you need to be the most effective leader you be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a lot to is “two things can be true, both can be true.” I this a lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This job hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going a war — all these things that have happened. so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I to find joy in my team. I feel like, in hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have be a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I a great support network around me and I do … My and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I for a couple of hours. I just disappear and walk around the city and I listen to my music and do whatever I to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work is to look very different in the future than how we describe today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I the idea of an office as a time and place completely goes away. I think it’s really going to be people are to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even concept of where you’re located is going to change. And then idea of like “I’m going to work on this zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. I think what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be using tools technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think the skill set to be a global CEO 30 ago versus what that will require now — I think in the future … the skill set is to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that provides and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that going to look very different. But I think the ultimate you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, it was time or place or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are to go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some the passion that you’ve talked about as being the that gives you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.