Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. I’m going to start with a really easy question: what was it like to this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has change. And as a leader, you obviously — you a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking control what’s happening around them. And I think what we all found, leaders, no matter what company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t control the environment and the things around you. And so, know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay as a team? How do we communicate in real and keep people informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just how do we with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve learned over the last few years is we each the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an team in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who are literally war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health or burnout, and so I think it was really just — the hardest was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, you lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. we did make a concerted effort to move away from email chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, your hands and your body and your emotions. And we that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record screen and just send a note out to people. new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow humanity and the context to come through and I that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it to talk about when things aren’t working, because a critical part being agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so one of the things that do at Vimeo is we try — I do in all of my town halls, we do it in a of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our top things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma from talking about what’s not working. And when you that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us be more open, as an organization, about what do we to change, what do we need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So many our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used video as a means of communication. Which brings me my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How do you the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the that we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot the mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, a very specific way. And if they then have to come to and to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if miss the meeting, and you have to watch the recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. so I think that there is definitely sort of — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy for saying the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to translate work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The thing I see from sort of the generation, the generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really the “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this is we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties the mission. And I think that that forces leaders really bring more of the “why” into how we and motivate people.
So those are two of the things see, and then, you know, the third I think just flexibility. I think — and this is true all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking for and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where try and orient it more to agility. How can we have and principles and be committed to things, but also know when to question, and when actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees are going to want, in terms of purpose or in terms of benefits in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put place that really speak to this big sea change we’re in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. I would say one of the things that we’ve tried to do is appreciate that when we get from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. can’t look at it all in totality and try and pull out an “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — you really dig into it and truly listen and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried to do have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I will tell you, of the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our to compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, the way we solve different things. And we used to a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the of consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s been one, and I will tell you, it has involved a lot of — as an executive team leadership team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, and them. And a great example is our Q and A. feel like every leader I know has a perspective whether they do open Q and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and know we will again, because we’re still figuring out right way to listen and have a dialogue with very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about sure that we are not just providing our youngest employees with flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also the and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for many more years. What is your and take on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I about that all the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We people in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of new executives have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve to literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve had to an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. How do share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? And so I think, from perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it ourselves and model and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism young people. I will say, like many companies … I do believe in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we bring people an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and time in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. don’t think they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really critical as leaders, we do that, so that this next is able to get the same growth opportunities that we had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations have really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having to go and find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a large of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit mental illness and the different things that people are to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m if you can share a little bit about how deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always the responsibility of a leader is to empower people to do their work and the responsibility of a company is to empower people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, the we initially probably sought to do that was more, know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, to so many of our managers … care. If we just care, a lot of things get easier. don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just the right people in place who care. At the same time, I say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, is that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can control Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things or don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, is where we should be spending more time — is how do we set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do we need do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software a service, so we already went from “growth at cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results and treat well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I think what I observed the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did because maybe it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — way you channel how you are caring towards your and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people their best work, which will deliver results, which will be for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be to that and if you use that consistently in decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you had a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make that you’re getting the balance you need to be the most effective leader can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a lot to is “two things can be true, both can be true.” I this a lot. And for me, I think of as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” went public at the height of the pandemic and year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things that happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s been this way, which is, for me, it’s I have have passion. I have to have passion. I have believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and I will — I can kind of move through anything. I to find joy in my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times work were when — in the hardest business situations. it’s because it brought a group of people together on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think have a great support network around me and I do … My and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk the city and I listen to my music and do I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how work is going to look very different in the than how we describe it today. It’s basically in office couple of days, work from home a couple of days. Tell us a little bit more about what could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. the concept of where you’re located is going to change. And then idea of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going go away. And I think what you’re going to find is more more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to be anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s — to basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are to look different. Because I think it’s going to — if you think about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago what that will require now — I think in the future … the skill set going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” of that is going to look very different. But think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time place or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going to away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart we use technology in the right way, that we’ll come away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.