Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to with a really easy question: what was it like to this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking control what’s happening around them. And I think what we all found, leaders, no matter what company you were … responsible for, that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and things around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we flexible as a team? How do we communicate in real time and keep people as we try and move through things? And then, also how do we lead with more humanity? You know, Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the last few years is we experience the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are the front lines, who are literally at war. On the other hand, you have people in different of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so think it was really just — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to build trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging this time with a culture that is more flexible nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you an example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or trust or create a greater sense of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s couple of things that we did. One — and we are a platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands and body and your emotions. And we did that through streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my screen and send a note out to people. Every new hire does a video to and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the context come through and I think that helped us a to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because a critical part being agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so one of things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in all of town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — always talk about what’s working, what are our top things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the away from talking about what’s not working. And when you make normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to more open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do we need to pivot. both of those, being more video-first in our communication being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love advice about being video-first. So many of our members of our workforce in a video world. They’re used to video as a means communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked how the organization has changed. How do you see workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, first wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the that we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. were designed for a totally different environment and a different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, the line between your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … If think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very way. And if they then have to come to work and to be on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s not going to happen. And so I think that there definitely sort of this — you know, we talk about “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate interact in our personal lives is going to translate to work. And I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing see from sort of the generation, the newest generation into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this is we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do something someone with formal authority told them to do it. want to do it because they understand why it matters, why it to the mission. And I think that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two the things I see, and then, you know, the third think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of all of us, particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking for and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and be committed to things, but also know to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can share a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your next generation employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there or processes you’ve put in place that really speak this big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of things that we’ve done, we have a people and NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for users, for our internal teams. But I would say one the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we get inputs our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look it all in totality and try and pull out an “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into it truly listen and do focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll find is there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind figuring it out, but I will tell you, some of things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach to work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark we have offices and teams in so many different countries the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve things. And we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, I will tell you, it has involved a lot of — as an executive team and team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, not working, and changing them. And a great example is our and A. I feel like every leader I know a perspective on whether they do open Q and or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the way to listen and have a dialogue with a diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure that we not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the that they need, but also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s the job for many more years. What is your and take on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know everyone will sort of have a solution for. I about that all the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and just be inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling at the top. So if my entire executive team distributed, that means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as executive team, for how we’re going to work together in environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it ourselves model it and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. do have — we bring people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to in and spend time in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really figured perfectly and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, do that, so that this next generation is able to get the same opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s — the tools that you mentioned at the very of our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having go out and find the information they need. And then, because we have tools available to us now, you know, they have an opportunity share their ideas with a large group of people, first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little about mental illness and the different things that people are to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if can share a little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves that challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of leader is to empower people to do their best and the responsibility of a company is to empower our to do their best work. And so, of course, have a real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, way I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the right people place who care. At the same time, I will what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to too many things or they don’t feel like they’re in doing those things. And that, I think, is where we should be spending more time — is how do we actually the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What is detail there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, know, one of our themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to be who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, so we already went “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot times when companies, we did things because maybe it lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, know, I sort of see it as — the way you channel how are caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people their best work, which will deliver results, which will be for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should be a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You you just had a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance you to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase use a lot to myself is “two things can true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. And me, I think of it as, like, “This job hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I have have passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is is important and matters for the world. And if I passion, I have energy and then I will — I kind of move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. I like, especially in hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some of my fulfilling times in work were when — in the hardest situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big part of it. then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. I am really fortunate. I think I have a support network around me and I do … My husband I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city and listen to my music and do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you about how hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than how describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from home couple of other days. Tell us a little bit about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: think the idea of an office as a time and completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going to to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of where you’re located is to change. And then the idea of like “I’m to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going go away. And I think what you’re going to is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s — to basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going to different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think about the skill set to be global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require now — I think in the … the skill set is going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and at scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it time or place or budget, in some cases. And I think those are going to go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, think you just showed us some of the passion you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.