Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: what was like to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. know, I think the only constant has been change. as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re to control what’s happening around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, no matter company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and the around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in time and keep people informed as we try and move through things? And then, just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the last years is we each experience the world so differently. We have who are remote. We have an incredible team in … employees who are on the front lines, who are literally at war. On other hand, you have people in different parts of the who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it really just — the hardest part was not being able give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I think it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re from this time with a culture that is more and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: you give an example of something that you put place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater sense community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that is a that you think you’ll continue to use in the far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that did. One — and we are a video platform, I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of the parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands your body and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous messages. So I send … I record my screen and just send a note out people. Every new hire does a video to welcome introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really was allow the humanity and the context to come through and I think that helped a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an that isn’t working. And so one of the things that we do Vimeo is we try — I do this in all of my town halls, do it in a lot of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma away from talking what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as means of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. do you see the workforce changing? What is different with young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work life is blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is used to content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then have to come to work to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you miss meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not to happen. And so I think that there is definitely of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just words for saying the way … we communicate and in our personal lives is going to translate to work. And so I think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing see from sort of the generation, the newest generation into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do something because someone formal authority told them to do it. They want to do because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And think that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of things I see, and then, you know, the third think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of of us, but particularly the younger generation — I they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it more to agility. How can have approaches and principles and be committed to things, but know when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, you share a few examples of ways that you Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or what your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve in place that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms of from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things that. And some of the things that we’ve done, have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But I would say one of things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we get inputs our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at it in totality and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into it and truly and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve just tried to do is have a bunch of different mechanisms and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I will you, some of the things that we’ve heard from employees have our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like I said, agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s particularly stark because we have offices and teams in many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we used to a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. really do. We have to design mechanisms to support teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the world around is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it has involved a of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. I feel every leader I know has a perspective on whether they do open Q and A or anonymous Q A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our there multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring the right way to listen and have a dialogue with a very workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, another thing I hear from CEOs of my generation and is a concern about making sure that we are just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s the job for many more years. What is your philosophy and take making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will of have a solution for. I think about that all time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and just more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort changed up the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to — we call it our operating system — we’ve had design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we to be able to do it ourselves and model it and then, think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask to come in and spend time in a room with their team, social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation able to get the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a of organizations that have really encouraged their young people to present, as way of having to go out and find the information they need. then, because we have video tools available to us now, know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, of going through the fact-finding and the research, and sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked little bit about mental illness and the different things that people bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we a lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about you deal with this increasing personal — you know, people bring their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the of a leader is to empower people to do their best work the responsibility of a company is to empower our to do their best work. And so, of course, we a real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, know, the way I think, like many companies, the we initially probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, to many of our managers … just care. If we care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you have the right people in place who care. At the same time, I say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive and actually the root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should be spending time — is how do we actually set the right and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think there are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results and people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I think I observed over the last few years is — that part, think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, any case. So, you know, I sort of see it — the way you channel how you are caring towards your and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping do their best work, which will deliver results, which will good for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to committed to that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do practice some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the you need to be the most effective leader you be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a to myself is “two things can be true, both be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I think it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” went public at the height of the pandemic and year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team Ukraine going through a war — all these things that happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then I will — can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were when — the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group people together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I really fortunate. I think I have a great support network around me I do … My husband and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around the and I listen to my music and do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: you talked about how hybrid work is going to look very different the future than how we describe it today. It’s in office a couple of days, work from home a couple of days. Tell us a little bit more about what you could potentially see evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a time and place goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even concept of where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled this date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I think what you’re going find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be using and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going require — if you think about the skill set to be a CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require — I think in the future … the skill set is to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and at scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that going to look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it time or place or budget, in some cases. And I those constraints are going to go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just us some of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much being here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.