Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: was it like to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has been change. And a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay flexible as team? How do we communicate in real time and people informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just how do we lead with humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve learned over the last few years is we each experience world so differently. We have employees who are remote. have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees who on the front lines, who are literally at war. the other hand, you have people in different parts the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and I think it was really just — the hardest part not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or trust or create a greater sense of community or to communicate that there is no certainty, that is muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. we did make a concerted effort to move away from and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands and your body and emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my and just send a note out to people. Every new hire does a video welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what really did was allow the humanity and the context to come through and I think that helped us lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile is we have an area that isn’t working. And so one of the that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do in all of my town halls, we do it in lot of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, framework that sort of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s us to be more open, as an organization, about what do we need change, what do we need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: love that advice about being video-first. So many of our members of workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. Which me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How you see the workforce changing? What is different with young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we think at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, is line between your personal life and work life is blending. … If you think about your personal life — at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in very specific way. And if they then have to come to work and to be trained a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that is definitely sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just words for saying the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to translate work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other I see from sort of the generation, the newest coming into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is we never talk about “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re to do” or — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. want to do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I that that forces leaders to really bring more of “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the things see, and then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. think — and this is true of all of us, particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide flexibility, but this is where I try and orient more to agility. How can we have approaches and and be committed to things, but also know when to question, when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of that you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to or understanding what your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of or in terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there or processes you’ve put in place that really speak to this big sea we’re seeing in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and surveys, and things like that. And some of the that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t at the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try and pull an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really into it and truly listen and do focus groups talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, average or the same. And for us, it’s been stark because we have offices and teams in so many different countries the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve things. And we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and what found is we have to be more localized. We do. We have to design mechanisms to support our teams a very different way, because their experiences and the around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and will tell you, it has involved a lot of — an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. I feel every leader I know has a perspective on whether they do open Q and A or anonymous and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring the right way to listen and have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because thing I hear from CEOs of my generation and older a concern about making sure that we are not just providing our youngest employees with flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a or to somebody who’s done the job for many more years. What is your philosophy take on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have a very distributed at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a workforce and being able to attract talent and just more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same kinds learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re it at the top. So if my entire executive is distributed, that means I have to learn how provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely the last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, an executive team, for how we’re going to work together that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we the right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s we have to be able to do it ourselves model it and then, I think it’s a more mechanism for young people. I will say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person is really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time a room with their team, do social activities, all those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor do think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, do that, so that this next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities that we had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of to go out and find the information they need. And then, because have video tools available to us now, you know, have an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and the different that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to the feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always the responsibility of a leader is to empower people to their best work and the responsibility of a company is to empower people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to do was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I say, to so many of our managers … just care. we just care, a lot of things get easier. don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have right people in place who care. At the same time, I say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should be spending time — is how do we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped to it.” Then, we should get into the “What is the detail there, and do need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. think the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work SAS, software as a service, so we already went from “growth at cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot times when companies, we did things because maybe it lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — way you channel how you are caring towards your employees and how are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do their best work, which will results, which will be good for the bottom line. And you have to that. You have to be committed to that and you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or how do make sure that you’re getting the balance you need to be most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, phrase I use a lot to myself is “two can be true, both can be true.” I say a lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic and last year, market has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s a job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort acknowledging both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been way, which is, for me, it’s I have to passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and for the world. And if I have passion, I energy and then I will — I can kind move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at my career actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, and care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have a great network around me and I do … My husband and I have deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple hours. I just disappear and I walk around the and I listen to my music and do whatever I to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you about how hybrid work is going to look very in the future than how we describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office a time and place completely goes away. And I it’s really going to be people are going to want work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of like “I’m going work on this time zone” or “I’m going to this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I that’s going to go away. And I think what you’re going find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to be anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going to different. Because I think it’s going to require — you think about the skill set to be a CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require — I think in the future … the skill set is going be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether was time or place or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart and use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.