Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. I’m going to start with a really easy question: what it like to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was challenging. You know, I think the only constant has change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s around them. And I think what we all found, leaders, no matter what company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. And so, know, for me, it was really about agility. How we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in real and keep people informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one the things I’ve really learned over the last few years is we experience the world so differently. We have employees who remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … who are on the front lines, who are literally war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health or burnout, and so I think it was really just — the hardest part was not able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can give an example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or trust or create a greater sense of community or to communicate that there is no certainty, that is muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a of things that we did. One — and we are a platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we make a concerted effort to move away from email chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to it with your face, and your hands and your body your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my screen and just a note out to people. Every new hire does a video welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the context to through and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, close. So that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And one of the things that we do at Vimeo is try — I do this in all of my halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — always talk about what’s working, what are our top things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma away talking about what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable for people, feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about what do need to change, what do we need to pivot. both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So of our members of our workforce live in a world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How do you the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, know, one of the things that we think about at a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were for a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I a lot of differences. One of them, I think, is the line between personal life and work life is definitely blending. … you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And they then have to come to work and to be trained on a job, read 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort of — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” the “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My told me that this is what we’re going to do” — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, don’t just want to do something because someone with formal told them to do it. They want to do it because understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I think that that forces leaders to really more of the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So are two of the things I see, and then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. think — and this is true of all of us, particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is I try and orient it more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and committed to things, but also know when to question, when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive it comes to addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees going to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? there programs or processes you’ve put in place that really to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But would say one of the things that we’ve really to do is appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at all in totality and try and pull out an “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you — when you really dig into it and truly listen do focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I will tell you, some the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to or our approach to DE and I. So I it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but treating everything as, like, an average or the same. for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have and teams in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, the way we solve different things. And we used to have a very, of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms to our teams in a very different way, because their experiences the world around them is quite different.
So I that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it has involved a lot of — an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q A. I feel like every leader I know has a on whether they do open Q and A or anonymous Q A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way listen and have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is concern about making sure that we are not just providing our youngest with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a mentor to somebody who’s done the job for many more years. What is philosophy and take on making sure that knowledge transfer happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will of have a solution for. I think about that the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re it at the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and for a whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of up the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to — we call it our operating system — we’ve to design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going to together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be to do it ourselves and model it and then, think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. will say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important learning. We do have — we bring people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks come in and spend time in a room with their team, do social activities, all those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and think it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have really their young people to present, as a way of having to go out and find the they need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, you know, they an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of going through fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit mental illness and the different things that people are to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about how you deal this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility a leader is to empower people to do their work and the responsibility of a company is to our people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a real to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, know, the way I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to do that more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. think that’s really important. And I always say, to so of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the right people place who care. At the same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people do too many things or they don’t feel like they’re in doing those things. And that, I think, is where we should be spending more time — is do we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What the detail there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, you think that there are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with and empathy, you will get better results. And so, know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few years — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, lot of times when companies, we did things because it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — way you channel how you are caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should in service of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which be good for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to committed to that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should be a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how you been taking care of yourself during this period tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance you need to be most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the I use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, can be true.” I say this a lot. And me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s of acknowledging both of those things has helped me a lot. The I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then I — I can kind of move through anything. I have to joy in my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were when — in the business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have be a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I really fortunate. I think I have a great support network around me and I do … husband and I have a deal, where on Sundays, disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I around the city and I listen to my music and do whatever I to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about hybrid work is going to look very different in future than how we describe it today. It’s basically office a couple of days, work from home a couple other days. Tell us a little bit more about what could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea an office as a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really to be people are going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even concept of where you’re located is going to change. And the idea of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I that’s going to go away. And I think what you’re going find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to be anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be using tools and — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think the skill set to be a global CEO 30 ago versus what that will require now — I think in the future … the skill set going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, audiences and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, provides context and alignment at scale? How do you programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” of that is going to look very different. But think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place or budget, in cases. And I think those constraints are going to away. And the promise is that if we are flexible smart and we use technology in the right way, we’ll actually come away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think just showed us some of the passion that you’ve about as being the thing that gives you energy lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.