Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. I’m going to start with a really easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, think the only constant has been change. And as leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company you … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. do we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in real and keep people informed as we try and move through things? And then, just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the I’ve really learned over the last few years is we each experience the world so differently. have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees are on the front lines, who are literally at war. On other hand, you have people in different parts of the world who are mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it was really — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I think it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to be agile flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can give an example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to communications or build trust or create a greater sense of community or to communicate that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of that we did. One — and we are a platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I my screen and just send a note out to people. Every new hire does a video to welcome and themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the context to come and I think that helped us a lot to, of, stay close. So that was one, I think, important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because critical part of being agile is recognizing we have area that isn’t working. And so one of the things we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in of my town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — always talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when you that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us be more open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice being video-first. So many of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used video as a means of communication. Which brings me my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What different with the young millennials, and even, now, the wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, know, one of the things that we think about at Vimeo a is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. were designed for a totally different environment and a totally different generation. I see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, is the line between your personal and work life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in very specific way. And if they then have to come to and to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? if you miss the meeting, and you have to the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s not going to happen. And so I think that there is sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of the generation, the newest coming into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really the “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” without “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — the that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They to do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. I think that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate and people.
So those are two of the things I see, then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where try and orient it more to agility. How can we approaches and principles and be committed to things, but know when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can share a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your generation of employees are going to want, either in terms purpose or in terms of benefits or in terms flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place that speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have a people culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t at it all in totality and try and pull out obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — you really dig into it and truly listen and do groups and talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I think us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind figuring it out, but I will tell you, some the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach to work or travel or even things like our approach compensation or our approach to DE and I. So think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an average the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we different things. And we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and what we found is we to be more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms to support our teams in very different way, because their experiences and the world around is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and will tell you, it has involved a lot of — as executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader I has a perspective on whether they do open Q and A anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of my generation and is a concern about making sure that we are not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility the purpose that they need, but also the training and the that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for more years. What is your philosophy and take on making that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a for. I think about that all the time. We a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive team is distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and able to attract talent and just be more inclusive. On flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same kinds of learning and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development a whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going to together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we the right communication loops? And so I think, from perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it ourselves model it and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks come in and spend time in a room with team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really out perfectly and I think it’s really critical that leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of that have really encouraged their young people to present, as a of having to go out and find the information they need. And then, because we video tools available to us now, you know, they an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little about mental illness and the different things that people bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can a little bit about how you deal with this increasing — you know, when people bring their whole selves to the office, which encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always the responsibility of a leader is to empower people to do their work and the responsibility of a company is to empower our people to their best work. And so, of course, we have a role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things get easier. don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the people in place who care. At the same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive and actually the root cause — that we can control Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should be spending more time — is how we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What the detail there, and do we need to do differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo this year “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software a service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few years — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, sort of see it as — the way you channel how you caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care of yourself this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned just had a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re the balance you need to be the most effective leader you be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a lot myself is “two things can be true, both can be true.” I say a lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public the height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped me lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I have have passion. I have to have passion. I have to so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy in team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look at my career and actually, some of my most times in work were when — in the hardest business situations. it’s because it brought a group of people together all on one team, so I think that’s been, you know, a really big part it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am fortunate. I think I have a great support network around and I do … My husband and I have a deal, where Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I disappear and I walk around the city and I listen my music and do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you about how hybrid work is going to look very different in future than how we describe it today. It’s basically office a couple of days, work from home a couple of days. Tell us a little bit more about what you could potentially see that into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a time and place completely goes away. And think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even concept of where you’re located is going to change. then the idea of like “I’m going to work on time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s to go away. And I think what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen and we will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, it’s AI — to basically enable that at scale among people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think about the skill set be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will now — I think in the future … the set is going to be like, “How do you with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in a that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints going to go away. And the promise is that if we are and smart and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank so much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. was great.