Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m to start with a really easy question: what was it like to manage diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has been change. as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re to control what’s happening around them. And I think we all found, as leaders, no matter what company were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay flexible a team? How do we communicate in real time and keep people informed as we try and through things? And then, also just how do we lead more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned the last few years is we each experience the world so differently. We have employees are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … who are on the front lines, who are literally at war. On other hand, you have people in different parts of the world are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it was just — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with a that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a sense of community or even to communicate that there is certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, I mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away from email chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to it with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And did that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my screen and send a note out to people. Every new hire a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what really did was allow the humanity and the context to through and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, close. So that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about things aren’t working, because a critical part of being is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. so one of the things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in of my town halls, we do it in a of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a that sort of takes the stigma away from talking what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about what do need to change, what do we need to pivot. And both of those, more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about video-first. So many of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used video as a means of communication. Which brings me my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How you see the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the that we think about at Vimeo a lot is lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that we still today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, think, is the line between your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … If you about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then have to come work and to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort of this — know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just words for saying the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives going to translate to work. And so I definitely that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” the “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this is we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is moving away, and people, they don’t just want to something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want to do because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And think that that forces leaders to really bring more of “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and is true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and committed to things, but also know when to question, when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your next generation of are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there or processes you’ve put in place that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net score, the same way we have for our users, our internal teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve really tried do is appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and and pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — you really dig into it and truly listen and do focus groups talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I think us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a of different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind figuring it out, but I will tell you, some the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or our approach to DE I. So I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, not treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because have offices and teams in so many different countries and differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve things. And we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and we found is we have to be more localized. We really do. have to design mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it involved a lot of — as an executive team and leadership — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And great example is our Q and A. I feel like leader I know has a perspective on whether they do open Q and A anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and have dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a about making sure that we are not just providing youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that need, but also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, being in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for many years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure that transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone sort of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have a very distributed at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and just more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn how to real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of new executives who have just joined. have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve had design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going to together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do create the right communication loops? And so I think, my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it ourselves model it and then, I think it’s a more proven for young people. I will say, like many companies … I do that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we bring people an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come and spend time in a room with their team, social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to get same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have really encouraged their young to present, as a way of having to go out find the information they need. And then, because we have tools available to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of going the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. an earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness the different things that people are bringing to work, it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a of people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, people bring their whole selves to the office, which encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves that challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of leader is to empower people to do their best work and the responsibility of a company is to our people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to do that more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, to so many our managers … just care. If we just care, a of things get easier. You don’t have to design hundred mechanisms if you just have the right people place who care. At the same time, I will what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach actually the root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people do too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing things. And that, I think, is actually where we be spending more time — is how do we set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What the detail there, and do we need to do differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software a service, so we already went from “growth at cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — and it hasn’t changed — I the best leaders and cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, me, I think what I observed over the last few years is — that part, think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times when companies, did things because maybe it was lip service or felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — the way you channel you are caring towards your employees and how you empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do their best work, will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. you have to believe that. You have to be committed that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have been taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do practice some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance you to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use lot to myself is “two things can be true, both be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I think it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went at the height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and matters the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then will — I can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at my and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were when — in the business situations. But it’s because it brought a group people together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have a great support around me and I do … My husband and I have a deal, where on Sundays, disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I around the city and I listen to my music and do whatever I to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid is going to look very different in the future than we describe it today. It’s basically in office a of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more about what could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a time and completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in world. Even the concept of where you’re located is going change. And then the idea of like “I’m going to on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. And think what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think about skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that require now — I think in the future … the skill set going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, provides context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve with, whether it was time or place or budget, some cases. And I think those constraints are going to go away. And promise is that if we are flexible and smart we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This great.