Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with really easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. know, I think the only constant has been change. as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to what’s happening around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. And so, you know, for me, was really about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? do we communicate in real time and keep people as we try and move through things? And then, also just how do lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one the things I’ve really learned over the last few is we each experience the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an team in Ukraine … employees who are on the lines, who are literally at war. On the other hand, have people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so think it was really just — the hardest part was not being able give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to be and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more flexible nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance or build trust or create a greater sense of community or even communicate that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, I mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands and your body and emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my screen and just send a note to people. Every new hire does a video to and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow humanity and the context to come through and I think that us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, a critical part of being agile is recognizing we an area that isn’t working. And so one of the things that we do at Vimeo we try — I do this in all of town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — is always about what’s working, what are our top three things, and isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a that sort of takes the stigma away from talking what’s not working. And when you make that normalized comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us be more open, as an organization, about what do we to change, what do we need to pivot. And of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that about being video-first. So many of our members of our live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of things that we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot the mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were for a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, the line between your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … If you about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, a very specific way. And if they then have to come to work to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if miss the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording of three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that there is sort of this — you know, we talk about “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to translate to work. And so definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a to really understand the “why” behind things. And one our communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want to do because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I think that that leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those two of the things I see, and then, you know, the I think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of all us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where try and orient it more to agility. How can have approaches and principles and be committed to things, also know when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your next generation of are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the things we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for our teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve really tried do is appreciate that when we get inputs from employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look it all in totality and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into it truly listen and do focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I think us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of different mechanisms and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but will tell you, some of the things that we’ve from employees have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our to compensation or our approach to DE and I. I think it’s more just like I said, that listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an average the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve different things. And used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of and fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have design mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I tell you, it has involved a lot of — an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. I feel every leader I know has a perspective on whether they do open and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our there multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the way to listen and have a dialogue with a diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the workplace for another moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of my and older is a concern about making sure that we not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility the purpose that they need, but also the training and wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the for many more years. What is your philosophy and take on making that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a for. I think about that all the time. We a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, think, a lack of the same kinds of learning and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So my entire executive team is distributed, that means I to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and for a whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an team, for how we’re going to work together in environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to able to do it ourselves and model it and then, I think it’s more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really for learning. We do have — we bring people into office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come and spend time in a room with their team, social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor do I think should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, do that, so that this next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having to go out and find information they need. And then, because we have video available to us now, you know, they have an to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of going the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and different things that people are bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about how you with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader to empower people to do their best work and the responsibility a company is to empower our people to do best work. And so, of course, we have a role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. I that’s really important. And I always say, to so many of our managers … just care. we just care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the people in place who care. At the same time, I will say what we’re now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and the root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — the root of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things or they don’t feel they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should be spending time — is how do we actually set the right and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do we to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to be stakeholders who say, know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, so already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective this — and it hasn’t changed — I think the leaders and cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few years is — part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a of times when companies, we did things because maybe it was service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort see it as — the way you channel how you caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, should not be a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the you need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the I use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, both can true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” went public at the height of the pandemic and year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team Ukraine going through a war — all these things that have happened. so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of both of those things has helped me a lot. The I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been way, which is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is is important and matters for the world. And if have passion, I have energy and then I will — I can kind move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. I feel like, in hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times work were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people all on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have a great support network around me and I … My husband and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear a couple of hours. I just disappear and I around the city and I listen to my music do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than we describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more about what could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think idea of an office as a time and place goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going to want to work anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. And think what you’re going to find is more and work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be using tools and — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that at among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that require now — I think in the future … the skill set is to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of is going to look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away a more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you showed us some of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing gives you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being here today.
AS: you. This was great.