Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start a really easy question: what was it like to manage this workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it really challenging. You know, I think the only constant been change. And as a leader, you obviously — have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re to control what’s happening around them. And I think we all found, as leaders, no matter what company you were … responsible for, was you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control environment and the things around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How we communicate in real time and keep people informed as we try move through things? And then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned the last few years is we each experience the world differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an team in Ukraine … employees who are on the lines, who are literally at war. On the other hand, have people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, so I think it was really just — the hardest part not being able to give everyone certainty, not being to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I think it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that you into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a sense of community or even to communicate that there is certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple things that we did. One — and we are a platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that through live a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I my screen and just send a note out to people. Every new does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that did was allow the humanity and the context to come through and I think that helped us a to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to about when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an area isn’t working. And so one of the things that we do at Vimeo is we — I do this in all of my town halls, do it in a lot of meetings — is always about what’s working, what are our top three things, and isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the away from talking about what’s not working. And when you that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to more open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So many of our members our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to as a means of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked how the organization has changed. How do you see the changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s different. And, you know, one of the things that we think about at a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot differences. One of them, I think, is the line your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they have to come to work and to be trained on a job, a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? if you miss the meeting, and you have to watch Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just going to happen. And so I think that there is sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just words for saying the way … we communicate and interact our personal lives is going to translate to work. And I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of the generation, newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is we never talk about “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re going to do” — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They to do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I think that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of things I see, and then, you know, the third think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger — I think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try orient it more to agility. How can we have approaches principles and be committed to things, but also know when question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of that you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing understanding what your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose in terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms of from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same we have for our users, for our internal teams. I would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t at the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really into it and truly listen and do focus groups and to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I will tell you, some the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many different countries the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of and fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences the world around them is quite different.
So I that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it has a lot of — as an executive team and team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, changing them. And a great example is our Q A. I feel like every leader I know has a perspective on whether they do open and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know we will again, we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and have a with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure that we are not just providing our employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s the job for many more years. What is your and take on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think about all the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. have people in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the of being able to have a distributed workforce and being to attract talent and just be more inclusive. On flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and for a whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we it our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, how we’re going to work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? do we create the right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more have to be able to do it ourselves and model it and then, I it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. do have — we bring people into an office. If you’re remote, we folks to come in and spend time in a with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they will go away, do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really that as leaders, we do that, so that this generation is able to get the same growth opportunities we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard a number of organizations that have really encouraged their people to present, as a way of having to go and find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of going through fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and the different that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always the responsibility of a leader is to empower people do their best work and the responsibility of a company is to our people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, way we initially probably sought to do that was more, know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I say, to so many of our managers … just care. If just care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have right people in place who care. At the same time, will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s reactive approach and actually the root cause — that can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to too many things or they don’t feel like they’re in doing those things. And that, I think, is actually where we be spending more time — is how do we actually set right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What is the detail there, and do need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do think that there are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work SAS, software as a service, so we already went from “growth at cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver and treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I what I observed over the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe it lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of it as — the way you channel how you are caring towards your employees and you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, will be good for the bottom line. And you have to that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You you just had a baby. There’s a lot on shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or how you make sure that you’re getting the balance you need be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, phrase I use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, both can be true.” say this a lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This job hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going a war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s hard job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I have to passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what is doing is important and matters for the world. And I have passion, I have energy and then I will — I can of move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at my career actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s it brought a group of people together all on one team, and I think that’s been, you know, a really big of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, and care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have great support network around me and I do … My husband and have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a of hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city I listen to my music and do whatever I to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work going to look very different in the future than how describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more about what could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the of an office as a time and place completely away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. the concept of where you’re located is going to change. then the idea of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — think that’s going to go away. And I think you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. then I think leadership, leaders are going to look different. I think it’s going to require — if you think about the skill set be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require now — I in the future … the skill set is going to be like, “How do you communicate diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in a that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was or place or budget, in some cases. And I those constraints are going to go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much being here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.