Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going start with a really easy question: what was it to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, I think only constant has been change. And as a leader, obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company you … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay flexible a team? How do we communicate in real time and people informed as we try and move through things? then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, of the things I’ve really learned over the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … who are on the front lines, who are literally war. On the other hand, you have people in parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, so I think it was really just — the part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to be agile flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: you give an example of something that you put place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or trust or create a greater sense of community or even to that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple things that we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have to about video, but I mean this sincerely — one the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands your body and your emotions. And we did that through streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my and just send a note out to people. Every new hire does a video to and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the context to come through I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about things aren’t working, because a critical part of being is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so one of the that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in all of town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — is always about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed to be more open, as an organization, about what do need to change, what do we need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about video-first. So many of our members of our workforce live in video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how organization has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What is with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the that we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They designed for a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a of differences. One of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work life definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a specific way. And if they then have to come to work and to be on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to watch Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just going to happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort of this — you know, we about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying way … we communicate and interact in our personal is going to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My told me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is moving away, and people, they don’t just want to something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want to do it because understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. I think that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, you know, third I think is just flexibility. I think — and is true of all of us, but particularly the generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, this is where I try and orient it more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles be committed to things, but also know when to question, and when to pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo tried to really be proactive when it comes to or understanding what your next generation of employees are to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of benefits or in terms flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place that really speak to this big change we’re seeing in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net score, the same way we have for our users, for internal teams. But I would say one of the things we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and and pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because you actually — when you really dig into it and truly listen and focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll find actually there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, think for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of it out, but I will tell you, some of things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach to hybrid or travel or even things like our approach to compensation our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but treating everything as, like, an average or the same. for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices teams in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the we solve different things. And we used to have very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the of consistency and fairness, and what we found is we to be more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms to our teams in a very different way, because their and the world around them is quite different.
So think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it involved a lot of — as an executive team and team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And great example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader I know has a perspective on they do open Q and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out right way to listen and have a dialogue with a diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I from CEOs of my generation and older is a about making sure that we are not just providing youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that need, but also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for more years. What is your philosophy and take on making that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have a very workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, think, a lack of the same kinds of learning and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn how provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of new executives who just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, how we’re going to work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we the right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to able to do it ourselves and model it and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for people. I will say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is important for learning. We do have — we bring into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in spend time in a room with their team, do social activities, all those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and think it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that next generation is able to get the same growth that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of to go out and find the information they need. And then, because we have video available to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their with a large group of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and the different things that people are to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve thought the responsibility of a leader is to empower people do their best work and the responsibility of a company is to our people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, know, the way I think, like many companies, the way initially probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, to so many of our … just care. If we just care, a lot of things easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you have the right people in place who care. At the same time, I will say what we’re now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach actually the root cause — that we can control Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. that, I think, is actually where we should be spending more time — is how do actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do we need do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo this was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work SAS, software as a service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, swing. My perspective on this — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with and empathy, you will get better results. And so, know, for me, I think what I observed over last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, I of see it as — the way you channel you are caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always be in service of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which be good for the bottom line. And you have believe that. You have to be committed to that and if you use that in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are not exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care of during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make that you’re getting the balance you need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: think — recently, the phrase I use a lot myself is “two things can be true, both can be true.” I say a lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic and last year, volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — these things that have happened. And so, it’s a job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important matters for the world. And if I have passion, have energy and then I will — I can kind move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times work were when — in the hardest business situations. it’s because it brought a group of people together all on team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big part of it. then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. think I have a great support network around me and I … My husband and I have a deal, where Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I disappear and I walk around the city and I listen to my and do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than how describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from home a of other days. Tell us a little bit more what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the of an office as a time and place completely goes away. I think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even concept of where you’re located is going to change. And then idea of like “I’m going to work on this zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going go away. And I think what you’re going to find is more more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to be anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s — to basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I it’s going to require — if you think about the skill to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus that will require now — I think in the future … the skill is going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across zones in a way that is effective, that provides and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that going to look very different. But I think the ultimate you’ll see is just … there were these constraints we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place or budget, in cases. And I think those constraints are going to away. And the promise is that if we are flexible smart and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that organization 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This great.