Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with a really question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, you — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s around them. And I think what we all found, leaders, no matter what company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control environment and the things around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate real time and keep people informed as we try and through things? And then, also just how do we lead more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the I’ve really learned over the last few years is we each the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who are at war. On the other hand, you have people in different of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it was really — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to be agile flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that you into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust create a greater sense of community or even to communicate that is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s couple of things that we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did a concerted effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and hands and your body and your emotions. And we that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So send … I record my screen and just send a note out to people. new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did allow the humanity and the context to come through and I think that helped a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an area isn’t working. And so one of the things that we do at Vimeo we try — I do this in all of town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — always talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. when you make that normalized and comfortable for people, feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, an organization, about what do we need to change, what do we need to pivot. And both those, being more video-first in our communication and being more and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. many of our members of our workforce live in video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. Which brings me to next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How you see the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, of the things that we think about at Vimeo lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, is line between your personal life and work life is blending. … If you think about your personal life — at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very way. And if they then have to come to work and be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s not going to happen. And so I think that there definitely sort of this — you know, we talk about “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to translate work. And so I definitely think that’s an area opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our mantras is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And think there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want to something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want to do it they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. I think that that forces leaders to really bring more of “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those two of the things I see, and then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. think — and this is true of all of us, but particularly younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this where I try and orient it more to agility. How can we approaches and principles and be committed to things, but also when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, you share a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing understanding what your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place that really speak to big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for internal teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve tried to do is appreciate that when we get from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. can’t look at it all in totality and try and pull an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really into it and truly listen and do focus groups and to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I think for us, we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of listening mechanisms and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still of figuring it out, but I will tell you, of the things that we’ve heard from employees have our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our to compensation or our approach to DE and I. I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s particularly stark because we have offices and teams in many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about way we solve different things. And we used to have very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of and fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design to support our teams in a very different way, their experiences and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, I will tell you, it has involved a lot — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot trying things, it not working, and changing them. And great example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader I know has perspective on whether they do open Q and A or Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve our approach there multiple times, and I know we will again, we’re still figuring out the right way to listen have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because thing I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure we are not just providing our youngest employees with flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for many more years. What your philosophy and take on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort of a solution for. I think about that all the time. have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re it at the top. So if my entire executive is distributed, that means I have to learn how provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of new executives have just joined. We have sort of changed up the team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had to with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve had design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be to do it ourselves and model it and then, I it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks come in and spend time in a room with their team, do activities, all of those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really that as leaders, we do that, so that this generation is able to get the same growth opportunities we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of that have really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having to go out find the information they need. And then, because we have video available to us now, you know, they have an to share their ideas with a large group of people, first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you a little bit about mental illness and the different that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader to empower people to do their best work and the of a company is to empower our people to do best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, way I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to do that more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If just care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the people in place who care. At the same time, will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root — that we can control at Vimeo — the root of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should be spending more — is how do we actually set the right and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we get into the “What is the detail there, and do we need to do differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, you think that there are going to be stakeholders who say, know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, as a service, so we already went from “growth at cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective this — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few years is — that part, think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a of times when companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service or felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — way you channel how you are caring towards your and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do their work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And you have believe that. You have to be committed to that and you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I a lot to myself is “two things can be true, can be true.” I say this a lot. And me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in going through a war — all these things that happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I to have passion. I have to have passion. I have believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then I will — can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at my career actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were when — in hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group people together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I really fortunate. I think I have a great support around me and I do … My husband and I a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city and listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how work is going to look very different in the future than how describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from home a of other days. Tell us a little bit more about what you could see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a time and place goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of like “I’m to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going go away. And I think what you’re going to find more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going to look different. I think it’s going to require — if you think about the skill to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require now — I think the future … the skill set is going to be like, “How do you with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in a that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether was time or place or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going to go away. the promise is that if we are flexible and smart we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away a much more and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the passion that you’ve about as being the thing that gives you energy to that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.