Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m to start with a really easy question: what was it to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, I think only constant has been change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I think we all found, as leaders, no matter what company you were … responsible for, that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and things around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. do we stay flexible as a team? How do communicate in real time and keep people informed as try and move through things? And then, also just how do we with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in … employees who are on the front lines, who literally at war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so think it was really just — the hardest part was being able to give everyone certainty, not being able just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, a company, to build more trust, because to be agile flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater sense community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far into future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. — and we are a video platform, so I obviously to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And did make a concerted effort to move away from and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your and your body and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record screen and just send a note out to people. Every new hire does video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, that really did was allow the humanity and the context to come and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile is recognizing have an area that isn’t working. And so one the things that we do at Vimeo is we — I do this in all of my town halls, we do it a lot of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when you make that normalized comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, an organization, about what do we need to change, what do we need to pivot. And of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: love that advice about being video-first. So many of our of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to as a means of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve about how the organization has changed. How do you see workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the that we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot differences. One of them, I think, is the line between your personal life work life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in very specific way. And if they then have to come to work and be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you miss meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that there definitely sort of this — you know, we talk the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to translate work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me this is what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do something someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want to do it they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger — I think they’re looking for flexibility and they options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and committed to things, but also know when to question, and when actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of that you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or what your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values from workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have a people and NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have our users, for our internal teams. But I would say of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you — when you really dig into it and truly and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, think for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge to pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of it out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from employees changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like I said, that listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been stark because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve different things. we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency and fairness, what we found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to design to support our teams in a very different way, because experiences and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and will tell you, it has involved a lot of — as an executive team and leadership — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q A. I feel like every leader I know has perspective on whether they do open Q and A anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and have dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of my and older is a concern about making sure that are not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a mentor or somebody who’s done the job for many more years. What is your philosophy take on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think about all the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of new executives have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, an executive team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. How we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be to do it ourselves and model it and then, I think it’s a proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many companies … do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we bring people an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come and spend time in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. don’t think they will go away, nor do I think should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really critical that leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities that all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard a number of organizations that have really encouraged their young to present, as a way of having to go out and find the information they need. then, because we have video tools available to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit mental illness and the different things that people are to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader to empower people to do their best work and the of a company is to empower our people to their best work. And so, of course, we have real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the I think, like many companies, the way we initially sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, to so many of managers … just care. If we just care, a of things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you have the right people in place who care. At the time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to too many things or they don’t feel like they’re in doing those things. And that, I think, is where we should be spending more time — is how do we set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get the “What is the detail there, and do we to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work SAS, software as a service, so we already went “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get results. And so, you know, for me, I think what I observed the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot times when companies, we did things because maybe it was service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — the you channel how you are caring towards your employees and how you empathetic, always should be in service of helping people their best work, which will deliver results, which will good for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should be a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You you just had a baby. There’s a lot on shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care how do you make sure that you’re getting the you need to be the most effective leader you be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a to myself is “two things can be true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. for me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going a war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I to have passion. I have to have passion. I have believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important matters for the world. And if I have passion, have energy and then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I to find joy in my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, look back at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. think I have a great support network around me and I do … My and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I disappear and I walk around the city and I listen to my music and whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked how hybrid work is going to look very different the future than how we describe it today. It’s basically in office a of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us little bit more about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea an office as a time and place completely goes away. And think it’s really going to be people are going to want work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept where you’re located is going to change. And then the of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going to away. And I think what you’re going to find is and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be using and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I it’s going to require — if you think about the skill to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require — I think in the future … the skill set going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, audiences and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it time or place or budget, in some cases. And I those constraints are going to go away. And the is that if we are flexible and smart and we technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that organization 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.