Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to with a really easy question: what was it like manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, you — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And think what we all found, as leaders, no matter company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. And so, you know, me, it was really about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do communicate in real time and keep people informed as we and move through things? And then, also just how do we lead with humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in … employees who are on the front lines, who are literally at war. On the hand, you have people in different parts of the world who are mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it really just — the hardest part was not being to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as company, to build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of that actually we’re emerging from this time with a that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that you into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or trust or create a greater sense of community or even to communicate that there is certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of the parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and hands and your body and your emotions. And we did through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent video messages. So I send … I record my screen just send a note out to people. Every new does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really was allow the humanity and the context to come and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to about when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so of the things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in of my town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — always talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to more open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video a means of communication. Which brings me to my question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. do you see the workforce changing? What is different the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. were designed for a totally different environment and a different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then to come to work and to be trained on job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if miss the meeting, and you have to watch the recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that is definitely sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” are just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate and in our personal lives is going to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My told me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want do something because someone with formal authority told them to it. They want to do it because they understand it matters, why it ties to the mission. And think that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and this is of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I and orient it more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles be committed to things, but also know when to question, and when actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples ways that you at Vimeo have tried to really proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what next generation of employees are going to want, either in of purpose or in terms of benefits or in of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some the things that we’ve done, we have a people and NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But I say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at it all totality and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into it truly listen and do focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll find actually there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge to pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our to hybrid work or travel or even things like approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices teams in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way solve different things. And we used to have a very, of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency and fairness, what we found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the world around them quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and will tell you, it has involved a lot of — an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And great example is our Q and A. I feel like every I know has a perspective on whether they do open and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the for just another moment, because another thing I hear CEOs of my generation and older is a concern making sure that we are not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose they need, but also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for more years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure that transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think about that the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits being able to have a distributed workforce and being to attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to — we call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an system, as an executive team, for how we’re going work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? do we create the right communication loops? And so I think, my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it ourselves and model it then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. do have — we bring people into an office. you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time in a with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next is able to get the same growth opportunities that all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have really their young people to present, as a way of having to go out find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a large of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and the different that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, people bring their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the of a leader is to empower people to do best work and the responsibility of a company is to empower our to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, many companies, the way we initially probably sought to that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. I always say, to so many of our managers … just care. If just care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have to a hundred mechanisms if you just have the right people in place who care. the same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, actually where we should be spending more time — is how do we actually set the right prioritization focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What is the detail there, do we need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think there are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, as a service, so we already went from “growth at cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the last years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe it lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — way you channel how you are caring towards your and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do their best work, will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. have to be committed to that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, should not be a trade-off. These are not mutually things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care of yourself during period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a lot your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you sure that you’re getting the balance you need to be the effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a to myself is “two things can be true, both can true.” I say this a lot. And for me, think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and matters for the world. And if I passion, I have energy and then I will — I can kind of move through anything. have to find joy in my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s it brought a group of people together all on team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have be a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am fortunate. I think I have a great support network around me and I do … My and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I disappear and I walk around the city and I listen my music and do whatever I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: you talked about how hybrid work is going to look very different the future than how we describe it today. It’s basically in a couple of days, work from home a couple of days. Tell us a little bit more about what you could see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an as a time and place completely goes away. And think it’s really going to be people are going to want work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I think what you’re to find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — you think about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus that will require now — I think in the … the skill set is going to be like, “How do communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I think the thing you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it time or place or budget, in some cases. And I think constraints are going to go away. And the promise is that if we flexible and smart and we use technology in the right way, we’ll actually come away a much more evolved and workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that organization 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.