Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going start with a really easy question: what was it like to manage this workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. know, I think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, you — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking control what’s happening around them. And I think what all found, as leaders, no matter what company you … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things you. And so, you know, for me, it was about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in time and keep people informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve learned over the last few years is we each experience the world so differently. We employees who are remote. We have an incredible team Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, are literally at war. On the other hand, you people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health or burnout, and so I think it was really just — the hardest part was not able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to build trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that you into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or a greater sense of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that think you’ll continue to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple things that we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I have to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of the parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And did that through live streaming a lot of communications, a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. I send … I record my screen and just send a out to people. Every new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the and the context to come through and I think helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an that isn’t working. And so one of the things that we do at is we try — I do this in all of my halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — is always talk what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort of the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about what do need to change, what do we need to pivot. And of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about video-first. So many of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video a means of communication. Which brings me to my question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How do you see workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal — look at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a specific way. And if they then have to come to work and to be on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not to happen. And so I think that there is sort of this — you know, we talk about “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the way … we and interact in our personal lives is going to to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. one of our communication mantras is we never talk about the “what” the “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — the that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want do it because they understand why it matters, why ties to the mission. And I think that that forces to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate and people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, you know, the third I think is flexibility. I think — and this is true of of us, but particularly the younger generation — I they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and it more to agility. How can we have approaches principles and be committed to things, but also know when question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can share a few examples of ways that you at have tried to really be proactive when it comes addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees are to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs processes you’ve put in place that really speak to big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some the things that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, same way we have for our users, for our teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at it all in and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — you really dig into it and truly listen and do focus and talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. so, I think for us, what we’ve really just to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re kind of figuring it out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our to compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many different and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about way we solve different things. And we used to have a very, of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the around them is quite different.
So I think that’s been one, and I will tell you, it has involved a lot of — an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. feel like every leader I know has a perspective on they do open Q and A or anonymous Q and A, real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to and have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure we are not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s the job for many more years. What is your philosophy and take making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have a very workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, think, a lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire team is distributed, that means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and for a whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. How do we real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we to be able to do it ourselves and model and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person is really important for learning. We do have — bring people into an office. If you’re remote, we folks to come in and spend time in a room their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really that as leaders, we do that, so that this next is able to get the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have really their young people to present, as a way of to go out and find the information they need. And then, because we have video available to us now, you know, they have an to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and research, and then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit mental illness and the different things that people are bringing work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot people coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when bring their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader is to empower people to their best work and the responsibility of a company is to empower people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have a role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, know, the way I think, like many companies, the we initially probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re a problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s important. And I always say, to so many of our managers … care. If we just care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have to design hundred mechanisms if you just have the right people in place who care. the same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — we can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have … focus, we’re asking people to do too many or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. that, I think, is actually where we should be spending time — is how do we actually set the right prioritization focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into “What is the detail there, and do we need to things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, me, I think what I observed over the last few is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times companies, we did things because maybe it was lip or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, you know, sort of see it as — the way you channel how you are caring towards your employees how you are empathetic, always should be in service of helping do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And you to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if you that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re the balance you need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I — recently, the phrase I use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, both be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I think it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic and last year, market has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s hard job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging of those things has helped me a lot. The I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing important and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I energy and then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, look back at my career and actually, some of my fulfilling times in work were when — in the business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big part it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I a great support network around me and I do … My husband and I have a deal, on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear and walk around the city and I listen to my and do whatever I need to do, and that’s important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work is going to look very different the future than how we describe it today. It’s basically office a couple of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea an office as a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really to be people are going to want to work from anywhere, in the world. Even the concept of where you’re located is to change. And then the idea of like “I’m to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s to go away. And I think what you’re going to find is and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that at scale many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders going to look different. Because I think it’s going to — if you think about the skill set to be a global 30 years ago versus what that will require now — I think the future … the skill set is going to like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in a that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How do you programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” of that is going to look very different. But think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place or budget, in cases. And I think those constraints are going to go away. And promise is that if we are flexible and smart and we use technology in the way, that we’ll actually come away a much more and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just us some of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.