Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here with today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with really easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant been change. And as a leader, you obviously — have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company you … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. And so, know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay as a team? How do we communicate in real time and keep people informed as try and move through things? And then, also just how we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one the things I’ve really learned over the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who are at war. On the other hand, you have people in parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so think it was really just — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as company, to build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give example of something that you put into place, perhaps the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater sense community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that is a that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple things that we did. One — and we are video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of the parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away from and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, do it with your face, and your hands and your and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous messages. So I send … I record my screen and just send a note to people. Every new hire does a video to welcome introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow humanity and the context to come through and I think that helped us a to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because a critical part of agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so one of the things that we at Vimeo is we try — I do this in of my town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — is talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve of created, I think, a framework that sort of the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. when you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us be more open, as an organization, about what do we to change, what do we need to pivot. And of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love advice about being video-first. So many of our members of workforce live in a video world. They’re used to as a means of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how organization has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What is different with young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we think about at a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for totally different environment and a totally different generation. But see a lot of differences. One of them, I think, is the line your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is used to content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then have to come to work and be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or you miss the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And so I that there is definitely sort of this — you know, talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the way … communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to translate to work. so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our mantras is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re to do” or — that, I think, is increasingly away, and people, they don’t just want to do because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want to do it because they why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I think that that forces to really bring more of the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So are two of the things I see, and then, you know, the I think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of all of us, but particularly younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and they options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and it more to agility. How can we have approaches and and be committed to things, but also know when question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples ways that you at Vimeo have tried to really proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of things that we’ve done, we have a people and NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we get from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look it all in totality and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because you actually — when you really dig into it and listen and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and among your employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I will you, some of the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed approach to hybrid work or travel or even things our approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been stark because we have offices and teams in so many different and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we used have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. We do. We have to design mechanisms to support our teams in a different way, because their experiences and the world around them is different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it has a lot of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And great example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader I has a perspective on whether they do open Q and or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there times, and I know we will again, because we’re still out the right way to listen and have a with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the workplace just another moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of my and older is a concern about making sure that we are not providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job many more years. What is your philosophy and take making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have a distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive team entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same kinds of opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our operating — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. How we share real-time feedback? How do we create the communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we to be able to do it ourselves and model it then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is important for learning. We do have — we bring into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come and spend time in a room with their team, do social activities, of those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor do think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really figured perfectly and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, we that, so that this next generation is able to get the same growth that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a of organizations that have really encouraged their young people to present, as a way having to go out and find the information they need. And then, because we video tools available to us now, you know, they an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and different things that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had lot of people coming to the office feeling trauma, feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you share a little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — know, when people bring their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of leader is to empower people to do their best work and the of a company is to empower our people to do best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like companies, the way we initially probably sought to do was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. think that’s really important. And I always say, to many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things get easier. don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just the right people in place who care. At the same time, I will say what we’re now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and the root cause — that we can control at — the root cause of a lot of stress burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should spending more time — is how do we actually the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m because there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What is the there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, so already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. so, you know, for me, I think what I observed the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of it as — the way you channel how you are towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. And have to believe that. You have to be committed that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, should not be a trade-off. These are not mutually things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care of yourself during period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You you just had a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, a leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make that you’re getting the balance you need to be the effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use lot to myself is “two things can be true, both be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, think of it as, like, “This job is hard, it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s hard job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort acknowledging both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s have to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what is doing is important and matters for the world. And if I passion, I have energy and then I will — can kind of move through anything. I have to find in my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling in work were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought group of people together all on one team, and so I that’s been, you know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, have to be a little selfish sometimes, and take of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have great support network around me and I do … My husband and I a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear I walk around the city and I listen to my music and do whatever need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you about how hybrid work is going to look very in the future than how we describe it today. It’s in office a couple of days, work from home a couple other days. Tell us a little bit more about what you potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of office as a time and place completely goes away. I think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of where you’re located is going change. And then the idea of like “I’m going to work on time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going go away. And I think what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we will be tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s — to basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And I think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — you think about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that require now — I think in the future … the skill set is going be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How do organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All that is going to look very different. But I think the ultimate you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve with, whether it was time or place or budget, some cases. And I think those constraints are going go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart and we technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.