Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m to start with a really easy question: what was it to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. You know, think the only constant has been change. And as leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, no matter company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. do we stay flexible as a team? How do communicate in real time and keep people informed as we try move through things? And then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really over the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in … employees who are on the front lines, who are literally war. On the other hand, you have people in parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it was really — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, a company, to build more trust, because to be and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time a culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can give an example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, enhance communications or build trust or create a greater sense of community or even to communicate that is no certainty, that is a muscle that you you’ll continue to use in the organization far into future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. One — we are a video platform, so I obviously have to about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make concerted effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to it with your face, and your hands and your body your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I my screen and just send a note out to people. new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really was allow the humanity and the context to come through and I think that us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk about things aren’t working, because a critical part of being is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. so one of the things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in of my town halls, we do it in a lot of — is always talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, what do we need to change, what do we need to pivot. And both those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So many our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. Which me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How do see the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s different. And, you know, one of the things that think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the and communication modes that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. were designed for a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a of differences. One of them, I think, is the line between your life and work life is definitely blending. … If you think about your life — look at TikTok. This generation is used consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And they then have to come to work and to be trained a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s not going to happen. And so I think that there is definitely of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are fancy words for saying the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going to to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a desire — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me this is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are of the things I see, and then, you know, the I think is just flexibility. I think — and is true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where try and orient it more to agility. How can we have and principles and be committed to things, but also when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing understanding what your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs processes you’ve put in place that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and surveys, and things like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for internal teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve really tried do is appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and and pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because you actually — when you really dig into it and truly listen and do focus groups talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different and desires among your employees. And so, I think for us, we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, not treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices and in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, the way we solve different things. And we used to a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. really do. We have to design mechanisms to support teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the world them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, I will tell you, it has involved a lot of — an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q A. I feel like every leader I know has perspective on whether they do open Q and A anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed approach there multiple times, and I know we will again, we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is concern about making sure that we are not just providing youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a mentor or to who’s done the job for many more years. What is your philosophy and on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think that all the time. We have a very distributed at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a workforce and being able to attract talent and just be more inclusive. the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, and development for a whole set of new executives have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our system — we’ve had to design an operating system, an executive team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. do we share real-time feedback? How do we create right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have be able to do it ourselves and model it then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. will say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is important for learning. We do have — we bring people an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time in a with their team, do social activities, all of those things. don’t think they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and think it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is to get the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of that have really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having go out and find the information they need. And then, because we video tools available to us now, you know, they have opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit mental illness and the different things that people are bringing to work, it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if can share a little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought responsibility of a leader is to empower people to their best work and the responsibility of a company is to empower people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, the way we probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if just have the right people in place who care. At the time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should be spending time — is how do we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What is the detail there, and we need to do things differently?” And, you know, of our themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective this — and it hasn’t changed — I think best leaders and cultures deliver results and treat people well. And I think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, know, I sort of see it as — the way you channel how you are caring towards employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service of people do their best work, which will deliver results, will be good for the bottom line. And you to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if you use that consistently your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are not exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care of yourself during period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a lot your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make that you’re getting the balance you need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I — recently, the phrase I use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, can be true.” I say this a lot. And me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public the height of the pandemic and last year, market has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in going through a war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s a job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I have to passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply what Vimeo is doing is important and matters for the world. And if have passion, I have energy and then I will — I kind of move through anything. I have to find joy my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, look back at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought group of people together all on one team, and so I that’s been, you know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, have to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have great support network around me and I do … My husband and have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city and I listen my music and do whatever I need to do, and that’s important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work is to look very different in the future than how describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: think the idea of an office as a time and place completely away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going to want work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going go away. And I think what you’re going to find is more and more work, from knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously we will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, it’s AI — to basically enable that at scale many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think about the skill set be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that require now — I think in the future … the skill set going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is to look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was or place or budget, in some cases. And I think constraints are going to go away. And the promise that if we are flexible and smart and we use in the right way, that we’ll actually come away much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed some of the passion that you’ve talked about as the thing that gives you energy to lead that of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much being here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.