Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going start with a really easy question: what was it like manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant been change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I what we all found, as leaders, no matter what you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control environment and the things around you. And so, you know, me, it was really about agility. How do we stay as a team? How do we communicate in real time and keep informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just how we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really over the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who literally at war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts of world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it really just — the hardest part was not being able to give certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as company, to build more trust, because to be agile flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging this time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: you give an example of something that you put place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a sense of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that is a that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far into future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. One — we are a video platform, so I obviously have talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous messages. So I send … I record my screen just send a note out to people. Every new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just video presentations. And actually, what that really did was the humanity and the context to come through and I think that helped a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it easier to talk when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so one of the things that do at Vimeo is we try — I do this in all of my town halls, we do in a lot of meetings — is always talk what’s working, what are our top three things, and isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a that sort of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when you that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s us to be more open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So many of our of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about the organization has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we think at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that we still today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment and a different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work life definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And they then have to come to work and to trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not to happen. And so I think that there is sort of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words saying the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of the generation, newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss me that this is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do because someone with formal authority told them to do it. want to do it because they understand why it matters, why it to the mission. And I think that that forces leaders really bring more of the “why” into how we and motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, you know, the I think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it more agility. How can we have approaches and principles and be committed things, but also know when to question, and when to pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to or understanding what your next generation of employees are going to want, either terms of purpose or in terms of benefits or terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. some of the things that we’ve done, we have a people culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have our users, for our internal teams. But I would say one of the that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we get inputs our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look it all in totality and try and pull out obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — you really dig into it and truly listen and focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll find actually there’s very different experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I think us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve from employees have changed our approach to hybrid work or or even things like our approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. So think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, the way we solve different things. And we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global in the name of consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design to support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the world around is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will you, it has involved a lot of — as an team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. feel like every leader I know has a perspective on they do open Q and A or anonymous Q A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of generation and older is a concern about making sure that we are not providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that need, but also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for more years. What is your philosophy and take on sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I about that all the time. We have a very distributed at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if my executive team is distributed, that means I have to how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely the last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an team, for how we’re going to work together in environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have be able to do it ourselves and model it then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. will say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person is really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks come in and spend time in a room with their team, social activities, all of those things. I don’t think will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and think it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so this next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities that all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having to go out and the information they need. And then, because we have video tools available us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a group of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little about mental illness and the different things that people bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of people to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves to office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader is to people to do their best work and the responsibility of a company is to empower our people to their best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting things mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And always say, to so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred if you just have the right people in place who care. At the same time, I will say we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s a approach and actually the root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — the root of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing things. And that, I think, is actually where we should spending more time — is how do we actually set the prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What the detail there, and do we need to do differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, you think that there are going to be stakeholders who say, know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results and people well. And I actually think, if you treat well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, me, I think what I observed over the last few years — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, think, a lot of times when companies, we did things because it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, any case. So, you know, I sort of see as — the way you channel how you are caring towards employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in service helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for the bottom line. you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you some self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting balance you need to be the most effective leader can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a lot to myself is “two can be true, both can be true.” I say this lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of the pandemic and last year, market has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then will — I can kind of move through anything. have to find joy in my team. I feel like, especially hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some of my fulfilling times in work were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s it brought a group of people together all on team, and so I think that’s been, you know, really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And am really fortunate. I think I have a great support network around me I do … My husband and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city and listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked how hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than we describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an as a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of like “I’m to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. I think what you’re going to find is more and more work, from knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and will happen asynchronously and we will be using tools and — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that at among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus that will require now — I think in the future … the skill is going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and across time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I think the ultimate you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time place or budget, in some cases. And I think constraints are going to go away. And the promise is that if are flexible and smart and we use technology in right way, that we’ll actually come away a much evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed some of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.