Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: what was it to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only has been change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and the around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we flexible as a team? How do we communicate in time and keep people informed as we try and through things? And then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the last few years is we each the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an team in Ukraine … employees who are on the lines, who are literally at war. On the other hand, you have people different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges burnout, and so I think it was really just — the hardest was not being able to give everyone certainty, not able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an example something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build or create a greater sense of community or even communicate that there is no certainty, that is a that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. — and we are a video platform, so I obviously to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your and your body and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … record my screen and just send a note out people. Every new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity the context to come through and I think that helped us a lot to, of, stay close. So that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because a critical part of agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. so one of the things that we do at Vimeo is we — I do this in all of my town halls, we do it in a of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our top things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a that sort of takes the stigma away from talking what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do we to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about video-first. So many of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video a means of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked how the organization has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? is different with the young millennials, and even, now, first wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s different. And, you know, one of the things that we think about Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very way. And if they then have to come to work to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? if you miss the meeting, and you have to the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s not going to happen. And so I think that there is definitely of this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate and interact our personal lives is going to translate to work. so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to understand the “why” behind things. And one of our mantras is we never talk about the “what” without “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — the that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me this is what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is increasingly away, and people, they don’t just want to do something because with formal authority told them to do it. They to do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to mission. And I think that that forces leaders to really bring more of “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it more agility. How can we have approaches and principles and be committed to things, also know when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what next generation of employees are going to want, either terms of purpose or in terms of benefits or terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms of values the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way have for our users, for our internal teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve tried to do is appreciate that when we get from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. can’t look at it all in totality and try pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” what you actually — when you really dig into it and listen and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and among your employees. And so, I think for us, we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I will tell you, of the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our to hybrid work or travel or even things like approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, not treating everything as, like, an average or the same. for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices and in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. We really do. We to design mechanisms to support our teams in a different way, because their experiences and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s been one, and I will tell you, it has a lot of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s a lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. a great example is our Q and A. I feel like every leader know has a perspective on whether they do open Q and or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, I know we will again, because we’re still figuring the right way to listen and have a dialogue a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about sure that we are not just providing our youngest with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s the job for many more years. What is your philosophy and take making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have a distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same kinds of opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So I it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and for a whole set of new executives who have joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re to work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more have to be able to do it ourselves and model and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration really important for learning. We do have — we bring into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time in room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, that this next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that really encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having to go out and find information they need. And then, because we have video available to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind of through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you a little bit about mental illness and the different things people are bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m if you can share a little bit about how deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the of a leader is to empower people to do best work and the responsibility of a company is empower our people to do their best work. And so, of course, we have real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, know, the way I think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought to do that more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if just have the right people in place who care. At the time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause of a of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things or they don’t like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, is actually we should be spending more time — is how do we actually the right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too much on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What is detail there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, know, one of our themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to be stakeholders who say, know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, so we went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, swing. My perspective on this — and it hasn’t changed — I think best leaders and cultures deliver results and treat people well. And actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, know, for me, I think what I observed over the last years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did things maybe it was lip service or we felt pressured. that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort see it as — the way you channel how are caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should in service of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice self-care or how do you make sure that you’re getting balance you need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the I use a lot to myself is “two things can true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. for me, I think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went at the height of the pandemic and last year, market has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going a war — all these things that have happened. so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s of acknowledging both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I to find joy in my team. I feel like, in hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times work were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a of people together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I a great support network around me and I do … husband and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city and listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than how we describe today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more about what you could see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a time and place completely away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going to want to from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of like “I’m going work on this time zone” or “I’m going to this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going to away. And I think what you’re going to find more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going to done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s — to basically enable that at scale among many people, in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because think it’s going to require — if you think about the set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus that will require now — I think in the … the skill set is going to be like, “How you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All that is going to look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it time or place or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are to go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, think you just showed us some of the passion that you’ve about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that organization 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.