Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, have technologists. So I’m going to start with a easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. know, I think the only constant has been change. And a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re to control what’s happening around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, matter what company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things around you. so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay as a team? How do we communicate in real time and people informed as we try and move through things? And then, just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the I’ve really learned over the last few years is each experience the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an team in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who literally at war. On the other hand, you have people different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and I think it was really just — the hardest was not being able to give everyone certainty, not able to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging this time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater sense community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you you’ll continue to use in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a of things that we did. One — and we are video platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but I mean sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when were communicating, to do it with your face, and hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record my screen and just send a out to people. Every new hire does a video to welcome introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the to come through and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, close. So that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because a part of being agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And so one the things that we do at Vimeo is we try — I this in all of my town halls, we do it in a lot of — is always talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, framework that sort of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I like it’s allowed us to be more open, as organization, about what do we need to change, what do need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: love that advice about being video-first. So many of our members our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to as a means of communication. Which brings me to my question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How you see the workforce changing? What is different with young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of things that we think about at Vimeo a lot is lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that we still today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally environment and a totally different generation. But I see lot of differences. One of them, I think, is the between your personal life and work life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal — look at TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, a very specific way. And if they then have to come to work and be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to watch the recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort of — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want to something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They to do it because they understand why it matters, why ties to the mission. And I think that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two the things I see, and then, you know, the I think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and committed to things, but also know when to question, when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when comes to addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees are going want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place that speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q As and engagement surveys, and things like that. And of the things that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the way we have for our users, for our internal teams. I would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look the averages. You can’t look at it all in and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, this how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when really dig into it and truly listen and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of figuring out, but I will tell you, some of the things we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach to hybrid or travel or even things like our approach to compensation our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an average or same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices and teams in so many different and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the we solve different things. And we used to have very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the of consistency and fairness, and what we found is have to be more localized. We really do. We to design mechanisms to support our teams in a very different way, their experiences and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely one, and I will tell you, it has involved a of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a example is our Q and A. I feel like leader I know has a perspective on whether they open Q and A or anonymous Q and A, real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on to the workplace for just another moment, because another I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a about making sure that we are not just providing youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also the training the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s the job for many more years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure that knowledge transfer happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I about that all the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce being able to attract talent and just be more inclusive. the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire executive is distributed, that means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development a whole set of new executives who have just joined. We have of changed up the executive team almost entirely in the twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to — we call it our operating system — we’ve had to an operating system, as an executive team, for how we’re going to work in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we create right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we to be able to do it ourselves and model it then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for people. I will say, like many companies … I do believe in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time in a with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they will go away, nor do think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really that as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to get same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — tools that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of number of organizations that have really encouraged their young people to present, as way of having to go out and find the information need. And then, because we have video tools available us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas a large group of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, then sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness the different things that people are bringing to work, it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives protests, we had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering if can share a little bit about how you deal with this increasing personal — you know, people bring their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve thought the responsibility of a leader is to empower people to do their best work the responsibility of a company is to empower our people to their best work. And so, of course, we have real role to play in supporting things like mental-health or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, many companies, the way we initially probably sought to that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms you just have the right people in place who care. At same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — the cause of a lot of stress and burnout is people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking to do too many things or they don’t feel they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, actually where we should be spending more time — is how do we actually set the prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we get into the “What is the detail there, and do we to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to be who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My on this — and it hasn’t changed — I think the leaders and cultures deliver results and treat people well. I actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I think I observed over the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we did because maybe it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s not going to sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what need, in any case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — the way you how you are caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, should be in service of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will good for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. have to be committed to that and if you that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have been taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a on your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or do you make sure that you’re getting the balance need to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I — recently, the phrase I use a lot to myself is “two things can true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort acknowledging both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve to kind of lead, has been — it’s always this way, which is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have and then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I to find joy in my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at my and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought group of people together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little selfish sometimes, take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have great support network around me and I do … My husband I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around the and I listen to my music and do whatever need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked how hybrid work is going to look very different in the future how we describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from home couple of other days. Tell us a little bit about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really to be people are going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the of where you’re located is going to change. And then idea of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. I think what you’re going to find is more and more work, from knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration happen asynchronously and we will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what will require now — I think in the future … skill set is going to be like, “How do you with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in a that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of is going to look very different. But I think ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going to away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away a much evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the that gives you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.