Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — have creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. I’m going to start with a really easy question: was it like to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was challenging. You know, I think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, you obviously — have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I what we all found, as leaders, no matter what you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always the environment and the things around you. And so, know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay as a team? How do we communicate in real and keep people informed as we try and move through things? then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of things I’ve really learned over the last few years is we experience the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, are literally at war. On the other hand, you people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so think it was really just — the hardest part was not being able give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an example something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance or build trust or create a greater sense of community or even to that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. — and we are a video platform, so I obviously to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands your body and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot of communications, a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. I send … I record my screen and just send a note out to people. Every hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was the humanity and the context to come through and I think that us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it to talk about when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And one of the things that we do at Vimeo we try — I do this in all of town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — is always about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort of the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And you make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us be more open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what do we to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: love that advice about being video-first. So many of our members of our workforce in a video world. They’re used to video as a of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How do see the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one the things that we think about at Vimeo a is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I a lot of differences. One of them, I think, is the line between your personal life work life is definitely blending. … If you think about personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then to come to work and to be trained on job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and you have to watch Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And I think that there is definitely sort of this — you know, talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just words for saying the way … we communicate and interact our personal lives is going to translate to work. And so I definitely that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this is we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. want to do it because they understand why it matters, why it to the mission. And I think that that forces leaders to really bring of the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of the I see, and then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. I — and this is true of all of us, but the younger generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where try and orient it more to agility. How can have approaches and principles and be committed to things, but also know when to question, and when to pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few of ways that you at Vimeo have tried to be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your next generation employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve in place that really speak to this big sea change we’re in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and surveys, and things like that. And some of the things we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net score, the same way we have for our users, for internal teams. But I would say one of the things that we’ve really to do is appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 … you can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at all in totality and try and pull out an “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really into it and truly listen and do focus groups and to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and among your employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind of it out, but I will tell you, some of things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach to hybrid work travel or even things like our approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, constantly really what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we different things. And we used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in name of consistency and fairness, and what we found is have to be more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms to support our teams a very different way, because their experiences and the world around them is different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, has involved a lot of — as an executive and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. feel like every leader I know has a perspective on whether they do Q and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, I know we will again, because we’re still figuring the right way to listen and have a dialogue with very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of generation and older is a concern about making sure that are not just providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and purpose that they need, but also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s the job for many more years. What is your philosophy and take on sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I about that all the time. We have a very workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being to attract talent and just be more inclusive. On the side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same kinds learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort of nice, we’re modeling it at the top. So if my executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn how to real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of new who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, how we’re going to work together in that environment. do we share real-time feedback? How do we create right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able do it ourselves and model it and then, I it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person is really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to in and spend time in a room with their team, social activities, all of those things. I don’t think will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is to get the same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s — the tools that you mentioned at the very beginning our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard a number of organizations that have really encouraged their young people to present, as way of having to go out and find the they need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, you know, they have opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind going through the fact-finding and the research, and then their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental and the different things that people are bringing to work, it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves to office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of leader is to empower people to do their best and the responsibility of a company is to empower our people to do best work. And so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting things mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, the way initially probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, lot of things get easier. You don’t have to a hundred mechanisms if you just have the right people in who care. At the same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — root cause of a lot of stress and burnout sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, think, is actually where we should be spending more time — is how we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, know, one of our themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already swung clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, so we went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — and hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, me, I think what I observed over the last few years is — that part, think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times when companies, we things because maybe it was lip service or we felt pressured. that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, know, I sort of see it as — the you channel how you are caring towards your employees how you are empathetic, always should be in service of people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You to be committed to that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should be a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, have you been taking care of yourself during this period of turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a lot your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or do you make sure that you’re getting the balance you need to be the effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, both can true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I think of as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We public at the height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — these things that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s always this way, which is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I have to have passion. I to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then I — I can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy in team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were when — in hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of people together on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I really fortunate. I think I have a great support network me and I do … My husband and I have deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around city and I listen to my music and do whatever I to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you about how hybrid work is going to look very different the future than how we describe it today. It’s basically office a couple of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I the idea of an office as a time and place completely goes away. And I it’s really going to be people are going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in world. Even the concept of where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. I think what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen and we will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then think leadership, leaders are going to look different. Because I it’s going to require — if you think about the skill set to be global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require now — I think in future … the skill set is going to be like, “How do you communicate diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in way that is effective, that provides context and alignment at scale? do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of is going to look very different. But I think ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time place or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going go away. And the promise is that if we are and smart and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away a much more and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that organization 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.