Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with a easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce through a pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. know, I think the only constant has been change. as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I think what all found, as leaders, no matter what company you … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, you couldn’t always control the environment and the things you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate real time and keep people informed as we try move through things? And then, also just how do we with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over last few years is we each experience the world differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees are on the front lines, who are literally at war. On the other hand, have people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, so I think it was really just — the part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to just a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to be agile flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more flexible nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give example of something that you put into place, perhaps the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create a greater sense of community or even communicate that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of that we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to move away from email chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I my screen and just send a note out to people. Every new hire does video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the and the context to come through and I think helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because a part of being agile is recognizing we have an that isn’t working. And so one of the things we do at Vimeo is we try — I this in all of my town halls, we do it in lot of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, framework that sort of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when you that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be open, as an organization, about what do we need change, what do we need to pivot. And both those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think been really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I that advice about being video-first. So many of our members of workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about how the has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, know, one of the things that we think about Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment and totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a specific way. And if they then have to come work and to be trained on a job, read 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour — that’s just not going to happen. And so think that there is definitely sort of this — you know, talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words saying the way … we communicate and interact in our lives is going to translate to work. And so I think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” I think there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do something because someone formal authority told them to do it. They want to do it because they understand why it matters, it ties to the mission. And I think that that forces leaders to really more of the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those two of the things I see, and then, you know, the third I think is flexibility. I think — and this is true of all of us, but particularly the generation — I think they’re looking for flexibility and want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this where I try and orient it more to agility. can we have approaches and principles and be committed things, but also know when to question, and when to pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that you at Vimeo have tried really be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding what your generation of employees are going to want, either in of purpose or in terms of benefits or in terms flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and and engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of things that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But I would one of the things that we’ve really tried to is appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t at the averages. You can’t look at it all totality and try and pull out an obvious “Oh, this how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into it and truly and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and among your employees. And so, I think for us, we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re kind of figuring it out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even like our approach to compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark we have offices and teams in so many different and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve different things. And used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and what we found is we have to more localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms to support teams in a very different way, because their experiences and the around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely one, and I will tell you, it has involved a lot — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is Q and A. I feel like every leader I know has a perspective on they do open Q and A or anonymous Q and A, real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring out the right way to listen and a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing hear from CEOs of my generation and older is concern about making sure that we are not just our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for many more years. What is your and take on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I it’s a major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think that all the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. So think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s sort nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed up executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve had deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, for we’re going to work together in that environment. How we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able do it ourselves and model it and then, I it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many companies … I do that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time in room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. don’t think they will go away, nor do I think should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so that this next is able to get the same growth opportunities that we had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, around video, can really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have really encouraged young people to present, as a way of having to go out find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a group of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding the research, and then sharing their ideas. In an comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and the different things that people are to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of people to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about how deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of leader is to empower people to do their best work and the responsibility a company is to empower our people to do their best work. And so, course, we have a real role to play in things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like companies, the way we initially probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or or time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. think that’s really important. And I always say, to many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a of things get easier. You don’t have to design a mechanisms if you just have the right people in place who care. At same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can control at — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we be spending more time — is how do we actually set right prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s too going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should get into the “What the detail there, and do we need to do things differently?” And, know, one of our themes at Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, you think that there are going to be stakeholders say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, so already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, will get better results. And so, you know, for me, I think what observed over the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, think, a lot of times when companies, we did things maybe it was lip service or we felt pressured. And that’s going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, sort of see it as — the way you channel how you are towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be service of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have be committed to that and if you use that in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you sure that you’re getting the balance you need to the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I — recently, the phrase I use a lot to is “two things can be true, both can be true.” say this a lot. And for me, I think of as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height of pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all things that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s I to have passion. I have to have passion. I have to believe deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and matters for the world. if I have passion, I have energy and then I — I can kind of move through anything. I have to joy in my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, look back at my career and actually, some of most fulfilling times in work were when — in the business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, have to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care yourself. And I am really fortunate. I think I have a great support network around me and I … My husband and I have a deal, where Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city I listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked how hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than we describe it today. It’s basically in office a of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us a bit more about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an as a time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really to be people are going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even concept of where you’re located is going to change. And then the of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and we be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, it’s AI — to basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere the world. And then I think leadership, leaders are going to different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think about the set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require now — think in the future … the skill set is going be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in way that is effective, that provides context and alignment scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” of that is going to look very different. But think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve with, whether it was time or place or budget, in some cases. I think those constraints are going to go away. the promise is that if we are flexible and and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you showed us some of the passion that you’ve talked as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being here today.
AS: you. This was great.