Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you lead workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to with a really easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was really challenging. know, I think the only constant has been change. And as a leader, you — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, no matter company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and the things you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. do we stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in time and keep people informed as we try and move through things? And then, also just do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of things I’ve really learned over the last few years we each experience the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who are at war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts of the world who are mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it was just — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able to apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, build more trust, because to be agile and flexible, to lead with humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with culture that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that you into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or create greater sense of community or even to communicate that there is no certainty, that a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that we did. One — and we are a platform, so I obviously have to talk about video, but I this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did a concerted effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and hands and your body and your emotions. And we did through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. So I … I record my screen and just send a out to people. Every new hire does a video to welcome and themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. And actually, what really did was allow the humanity and the context to through and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because a critical part of being agile recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And one of the things that we do at Vimeo is we — I do this in all of my town halls, do it in a lot of meetings — is talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the away from talking about what’s not working. And when you that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, as organization, about what do we need to change, what do we need to pivot. And of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice being video-first. So many of our members of our live in a video world. They’re used to video as a means of communication. Which brings me my next question. You’ve talked about how the organization changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What is different with the millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we think about at a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then have to come to and to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or you miss the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think that there is sort of this — you know, we talk about “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate interact in our personal lives is going to translate to work. And I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this is what we’re to do” or — that, I think, is increasingly away, and people, they don’t just want to do something because someone formal authority told them to do it. They want to do it because they why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I think that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two the things I see, and then, you know, the third I think is just flexibility. think — and this is true of all of us, but the younger generation — I think they’re looking for and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I and orient it more to agility. How can we have and principles and be committed to things, but also when to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, you share a few examples of ways that you Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or what your next generation of employees are going to want, in terms of purpose or in terms of benefits in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve put in place that speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, way we’ve tried to listen and understand our workforce very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, and like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have a and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way have for our users, for our internal teams. But would say one of the things that we’ve really tried do is appreciate that when we get inputs from employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at the averages. can’t look at it all in totality and try pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into and truly listen and do focus groups and talk to people — you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, we’re still kind of figuring it out, but I tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like I said, that agile listening, really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices and teams in so many countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, the way we solve different things. And we used to have very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency and fairness, and we found is we have to be more localized. We do. We have to design mechanisms to support our in a very different way, because their experiences and world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, it involved a lot of — as an executive team leadership team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, not working, and changing them. And a great example is Q and A. I feel like every leader I know a perspective on whether they do open Q and A or anonymous and A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still figuring the right way to listen and have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: want to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I from CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure that are not just providing our youngest employees with the and the purpose that they need, but also the and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the for many more years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure that transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major that I don’t know that everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think about all the time. We have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being able have a distributed workforce and being able to attract talent and just be inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, lack of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, for the youngest folks that are entering the workforce. I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling at the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn how provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a whole set of new who have just joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost in the last twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call our operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, as an executive team, how we’re going to work together in that environment. How do we real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? And so I think, my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it ourselves model it and then, I think it’s a more mechanism for young people. I will say, like many companies … I believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — bring people into an office. If you’re remote, we ask to come in and spend time in a room with team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s critical that as leaders, we do that, so that next generation is able to get the same growth opportunities that we had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a of organizations that have really encouraged their young people present, as a way of having to go out find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools to us now, you know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a large group of people, first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and sharing their ideas. In an earlier comment, you talked little bit about mental illness and the different things that people are bringing to work, it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives protests, we had a lot of people coming to office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m if you can share a little bit about how deal with this increasing personal — you know, when bring their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, of themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always the responsibility of a leader is to empower people to their best work and the responsibility of a company is to our people to do their best work. And so, course, we have a real role to play in supporting like mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way think, like many companies, the way we initially probably sought do that was more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. I always say, to so many of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms you just have the right people in place who care. the same time, I will say what we’re realizing now, sort of this next phase, is that that’s a reactive approach actually the root cause — that we can control at Vimeo — the root cause a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too many or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing things. And that, I think, is actually where we be spending more time — is how do we actually set the right and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s a root cause that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we get into the “What is the detail there, and do we need to things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think pendulum has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, as a service, so we already went from “growth all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results and treat people well. And actually think, if you treat people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get results. And so, you know, for me, I think what I over the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. were, I think, a lot of times when companies, did things because maybe it was lip service or felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, you know, I sort see it as — the way you channel how you are caring your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be in of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are not exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care of yourself this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a lot your shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care how do you make sure that you’re getting the balance you to be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I a lot to myself is “two things can be true, both can be true.” I this a lot. And for me, I think of it as, like, “This job hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton with post-pandemic, we a team in Ukraine going through a war — these things that have happened. And so, it’s a job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those has helped me a lot. The way I’ve tried kind of lead, has been — it’s always been this way, is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. I to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is is important and matters for the world. And if I passion, I have energy and then I will — I can kind of move anything. I have to find joy in my team. feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some my most fulfilling times in work were when — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it a group of people together all on one team, so I think that’s been, you know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, have to be a little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. I am really fortunate. I think I have a support network around me and I do … My husband I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for a couple hours. I just disappear and I walk around the city I listen to my music and do whatever I to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid is going to look very different in the future how we describe it today. It’s basically in office couple of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell a little bit more about what you could potentially see evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as a time place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the of where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea of “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I think what you’re going to find more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously we will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that at among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 ago versus what that will require now — I think in the future … skill set is going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that provides context and alignment scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints going to go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll come away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for here today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.