Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: what it like to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a reckoning and a very fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant been change. And as a leader, you obviously — have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And think what we all found, as leaders, no matter what company were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and the around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do stay flexible as a team? How do we communicate in real and keep people informed as we try and move things? And then, also just how do we lead with more humanity? know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned over the last few years is we each the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, are literally at war. On the other hand, you people in different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges burnout, and so I think it was really just — the hardest part not being able to give everyone certainty, not being to just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I think it forced us, as a company, to build trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have trust each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, enhance communications or build trust or create a greater sense of community even to communicate that there is no certainty, that a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that did. One — and we are a video platform, so obviously have to talk about video, but I mean this — one of the hardest parts, when you’re all sort disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make concerted effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, much as possible, and actually try, particularly for our team, when we were communicating, to do it with your face, and your hands and body and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent video messages. So I send … I record my screen and send a note out to people. Every new hire does a to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did allow the humanity and the context to come through and I think that us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. so one of the things that we do at Vimeo is try — I do this in all of my town halls, do it in a lot of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma away from about what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, an organization, about what do we need to change, what we need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more and normalizing what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and certainly something we’re forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re to video as a means of communication. Which brings to my next question. You’ve talked about how the has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What is with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we think about at Vimeo lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication that we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for totally different environment and a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life and work life definitely blending. … If you think about your personal — look at TikTok. This generation is used to content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they then have to to work and to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And I think that there is definitely sort of this — know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those just fancy words for saying the way … we communicate and interact our personal lives is going to translate to work. And so definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other I see from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming the workforce, is sort of, of course mission-driven, but think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is we talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a desire — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me this is what we’re going to do” or — that, think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. I think that that forces leaders to really bring more of “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two the things I see, and then, you know, the third think is just flexibility. I think — and this is true of of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s always easy and feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but is where I try and orient it more to agility. How can we have and principles and be committed to things, but also know when question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to or understanding what your next generation of employees are to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? there programs or processes you’ve put in place that speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? And think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, things like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have a people culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But would say one of the things that we’ve really tried do is appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” what you actually — when you really dig into it and truly listen do focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really tried to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still of figuring it out, but I will tell you, some the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like I said, agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly because we have offices and teams in so many different countries the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about the way we solve different things. And used to have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global in the name of consistency and fairness, and what we found we have to be more localized. We really do. We have to design to support our teams in a very different way, because their and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s been one, and I will tell you, it has involved a lot of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is our and A. I feel like every leader I know has perspective on whether they do open Q and A or anonymous Q and A, real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know will again, because we’re still figuring out the right to listen and have a dialogue with a very workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers to the workplace just another moment, because another thing I hear from CEOs of my generation and older is a about making sure that we are not just providing our youngest employees with the and the purpose that they need, but also the and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the for many more years. What is your philosophy and on making sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know everyone will sort of have a solution for. I about that all the time. We have a very distributed workforce Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive team is distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being to have a distributed workforce and being able to talent and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a of the same kinds of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that are entering workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire executive is distributed, that means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, and development for a whole set of new executives who have joined. We have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in the twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to — we call it our operating system — we’ve to design an operating system, as an executive team, for we’re going to work together in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How do we the right communication loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to able to do it ourselves and model it and then, I think it’s a proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. We do have — we bring people an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t think they will away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really out perfectly and I think it’s really critical that as leaders, we do that, so this next generation is able to get the same growth that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at the very of our conversation, around video, can be really helpful there. I’ve of a number of organizations that have really encouraged young people to present, as a way of having to go out find the information they need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, know, they have an opportunity to share their ideas with a group of people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and the things that people are bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m wondering you can share a little bit about how you deal with increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves to the office, which encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader to empower people to do their best work and the responsibility of a company to empower our people to do their best work. And so, of course, have a real role to play in supporting things mental-health issues or burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, the we initially probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s really important. I always say, to so many of our managers … care. If we just care, a lot of things get easier. don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just the right people in place who care. At the same time, I say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this phase, is that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can at Vimeo — the root cause of a lot stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, think, is actually where we should be spending more time — is how we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do we need do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo this was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, sideways, do you think that there are going to be who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software a service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and deliver results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, with and empathy, you will get better results. And so, know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few years is — that part, think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of when companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service or we pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s not what need, in any case. So, you know, I sort see it as — the way you channel how are caring towards your employees and how you are empathetic, always should be service of helping people do their best work, which will deliver results, which will be good for bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have be committed to that and if you use that consistently in decision-making, it should not be a trade-off. These are mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil change, but also growth? You mentioned you just had baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make that you’re getting the balance you need to be most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the I use a lot to myself is “two things be true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. for me, I think of it as, like, “This is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going through a ton post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through a war — all these things that have happened. so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped me lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, been — it’s always been this way, which is, for me, it’s have to have passion. I have to have passion. I to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important matters for the world. And if I have passion, have energy and then I will — I can kind move through anything. I have to find joy in my team. feel like, especially in hard times, I look back my career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were — in the hardest business situations. But it’s because it a group of people together all on one team, and so think that’s been, you know, a really big part it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be little selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And am really fortunate. I think I have a great support around me and I do … My husband and I have a deal, on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. just disappear and I walk around the city and listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how work is going to look very different in the future than how we describe it today. It’s in office a couple of days, work from home couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea an office as a time and place completely goes away. And think it’s really going to be people are going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere the world. Even the concept of where you’re located is going to change. then the idea of like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m to attend this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously we will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s — to basically enable that at scale among many people, in the world. And then I think leadership, leaders going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — you think about the skill set to be a global CEO 30 ago versus what that will require now — I think in future … the skill set is going to be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, audiences and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, provides context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going look very different. But I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were constraints that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart and we technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us of the passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy lead that organization of 1,300 people worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being today.
AS: Thank you. This was great.