Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m glad you’re here with us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you creatives, you have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: what it like to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a fraught return to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has change. And as a leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s for certainty, and they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I think what all found, as leaders, no matter what company you … responsible for, was that you couldn’t offer certainty, and you couldn’t always control the and the things around you. And so, you know, for me, it was really about agility. How do we stay as a team? How do we communicate in real time and keep people as we try and move through things? And then, just how do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve really learned the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible in Ukraine … employees who are on the front lines, who are at war. On the other hand, you have people in different parts of the world who are mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I think it really just — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I ultimately it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because to be and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you have to each other. And so, I’m sort of optimistic that actually we’re emerging from time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give an example of something that put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance or build trust or create a greater sense of community even to communicate that there is no certainty, that a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use in the organization far the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that did. One — and we are a video platform, so I have to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of the hardest parts, when you’re sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did a concerted effort to move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much possible, and actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, do it with your face, and your hands and your and your emotions. And we did that through live streaming a lot communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. I send … I record my screen and just send note out to people. Every new hire does a video to and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually replaced with just video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow humanity and the context to come through and I think helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, really thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, because critical part of being agile is recognizing we have area that isn’t working. And so one of the things that we at Vimeo is we try — I do this in all my town halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — is talk about what’s working, what are our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and comfortable people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be open, as an organization, about what do we need to change, what we need to pivot. And both of those, being more video-first our communication and being more transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: love that advice about being video-first. So many of our members of our live in a video world. They’re used to video as a of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked how the organization has changed. How do you see the workforce changing? What different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave of Gen Z coming into workplace?
AS: I think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things we think about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of mechanisms and communication modes that we still use today, they’re antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment a totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One them, I think, is the line between your personal life and life is definitely blending. … If you think about your life — look at TikTok. This generation is used consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. And if they have to come to work and to be trained on job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? if you miss the meeting, and you have to the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not going to happen. And so I think there is definitely sort of this — you know, we about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for saying the … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is going translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other I see from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, sort of, of course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand “why” behind things. And one of our communication mantras is never talk about the “what” without the “why.” And I think there’s a to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, “My boss told me that this is what we’re going do” or — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t just want to something because someone with formal authority told them to do it. They want do it because they understand why it matters, why ties to the mission. And I think that that leaders to really bring more of the “why” into how we and motivate people.
So those are two of the things I see, and then, know, the third I think is just flexibility. I think — and is true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and feasible provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient more to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and committed to things, but also know when to question, when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways you at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes addressing or understanding what your next generation of employees are to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms of or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or you’ve put in place that really speak to this sea change we’re seeing in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all listening, right? And I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried listen and understand our workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As engagement surveys, and things like that. And some of the that we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the way we have for our users, for our internal teams. I would say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … can’t look at the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try pull out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — you really dig into it and truly listen and focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll is actually there’s very different experiences and desires among employees. And so, I think for us, what we’ve really just tried to is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind figuring it out, but I will tell you, some the things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach compensation or our approach to DE and I. So I think it’s more just like I said, that listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an average the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices and in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, about way we solve different things. And we used to a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of and fairness, and what we found is we have to be more localized. We do. We have to design mechanisms to support our teams in a very way, because their experiences and the world around them is different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, has involved a lot of — as an executive team and leadership — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a example is our Q and A. I feel like leader I know has a perspective on whether they do open and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time and A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still out the right way to listen and have a dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I to stay on newcomers to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I hear CEOs of my generation and older is a concern about making sure that we are not providing our youngest employees with the flexibility and the purpose they need, but also the training and the wisdom comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job many more years. What is your philosophy and take on sure that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a challenge that I don’t know that everyone will sort have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We have very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people in over eight countries. My executive is entirely distributed. So I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce being able to attract talent and just be more inclusive. On flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same kinds of opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve taking, and what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to learn to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a set of new executives who have just joined. We have sort of changed the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. So I’ve to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it operating system — we’ve had to design an operating system, an executive team, for how we’re going to work together in that environment. do we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right communication loops? And so think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do ourselves and model it and then, I think it’s a proven mechanism for young people. I will say, like many companies … do believe that in-person collaboration is really important for learning. do have — we bring people into an office. you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time a room with their team, do social activities, all of things. I don’t think they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly I think it’s really critical that as leaders, we that, so that this next generation is able to get same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have encouraged their young people to present, as a way of having go out and find the information they need. And then, we have video tools available to us now, you know, they have opportunity to share their ideas with a large group people, but first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. an earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness the different things that people are bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble the surface. I’m wondering if you can share a little bit about you deal with this increasing personal — you know, when people their whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts of that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of leader is to empower people to do their best work the responsibility of a company is to empower our to do their best work. And so, of course, we a real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues or burnout. And, know, the way I think, like many companies, the we initially probably sought to do that was more, you know, you’re seeing problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health or support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, empathy. I think that’s really important. And I always say, so many of our managers … just care. If we care, a lot of things get easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just the right people in place who care. At the same time, I say what we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can control Vimeo — the root cause of a lot of stress and is sometimes people either don’t have enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things or don’t feel like they’re supported in doing those things. And that, I think, is actually where should be spending more time — is how do actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s some there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I like I’m stressed because there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we get into the “What is the detail there, and we need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, move sideways, do think that there are going to be stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the has already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work SAS, software as a service, so we already went “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. perspective on this — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results treat people well. And I actually think, if you treat people well, kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, know, for me, I think what I observed over the few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t and shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of times companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s what — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in case. So, you know, I sort of see it as — way you channel how you are caring towards your employees and how are empathetic, always should be in service of helping people do their work, which will deliver results, which will be good the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be to that and if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it not be a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have you been taking care of yourself this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you just a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do make sure that you’re getting the balance you need to be the most effective you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the phrase I use a lot to myself is “two can be true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. And for me, I think of as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went at the height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously through a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team Ukraine going through a war — all these things that happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? so, I think for me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped a lot. The way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been way, which is, for me, it’s I have to passion. I have to have passion. I have to so deeply that what Vimeo is doing is important and for the world. And if I have passion, I energy and then I will — I can kind of move through anything. have to find joy in my team. I feel like, especially hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some of my fulfilling times in work were when — in the business situations. But it’s because it brought a group of together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, know, a really big part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am fortunate. I think I have a great support network around and I do … My husband and I have a deal, on Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. just disappear and I walk around the city and I listen my music and do whatever I need to do, and that’s important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid work is going to look very different in the future how we describe it today. It’s basically in office a of days, work from home a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I think the idea of an office as time and place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the of where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. And think what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen and we will be using tools and technology — it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that at scale many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think about skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will require now — think in the future … the skill set is going be like, “How do you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees time zones in a way that is effective, that provides and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I think ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these that we’ve lived with, whether it was time or place or budget, some cases. And I think those constraints are going to away. And the promise is that if we are flexible smart and we use technology in the right way, that we’ll come away a much more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think just showed us some of the passion that you’ve talked about as being thing that gives you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being here today.
AS: you. This was great.