Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here us today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: Vimeo, you lead a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, you have finance people, you technologists. So I’m going to start with a really easy question: what was like to manage this diverse workforce through a global pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught to office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, was really challenging. You know, I think the only constant has been change. And as leader, you obviously — you have a workforce that’s looking for certainty, they’re looking to control what’s happening around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, no what company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and things around you. And so, you know, for me, was really about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? How we communicate in real time and keep people informed as try and move through things? And then, also just do we lead with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve learned over the last few years is we each experience the so differently. We have employees who are remote. We an incredible team in Ukraine … employees who are the front lines, who are literally at war. On the hand, you have people in different parts of the who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so think it was really just — the hardest part was not being to give everyone certainty, not being able to just apply a one-size-fits-all for everyone. But I ultimately think it forced us, as a company, to build trust, because to be agile and flexible, and to lead humanity, you have to trust each other. And so, I’m sort optimistic that actually we’re emerging from this time with a that is more flexible and nimble, and also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: you give an example of something that you put into place, perhaps during the pandemic, to enhance communications build trust or create a greater sense of community or even to that there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to in the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of that we did. One — and we are a video platform, so I obviously have talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is lose context and you lose nuance when you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort move away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, and actually try, particularly our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did that live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. We sent asynchronous video messages. I send … I record my screen and just send a note out to people. Every new does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of meetings we’ve actually replaced with just quick video presentations. actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and context to come through and I think that helped us a lot to, kind of, stay close. that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another important thing is, I think, just creating to make it easier to talk about when things aren’t working, a critical part of being agile is recognizing we have an area that isn’t working. And one of the things that we do at Vimeo we try — I do this in all of my halls, we do it in a lot of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what are our three things, and what isn’t working — yet. And we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework sort of takes the stigma away from talking about what’s not working. And when make that normalized and comfortable for people, I feel it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about what do need to change, what do we need to pivot. And of those, being more video-first in our communication and being transparent and normalizing what’s not working, I think has really helpful, and certainly something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about video-first. So many of our members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re to video as a means of communication. Which brings me to next question. You’ve talked about how the organization has changed. How you see the workforce changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the first wave Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: I think it’s different. And, you know, one of the things that we think at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes we still use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment and totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. One of them, think, is the line between your personal life and work life definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look at TikTok. This generation is to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very specific way. if they then have to come to work and to trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s not going to happen, right? Or if you the meeting, and you have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not to happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort of this — you know, talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words for the way … we communicate and interact in our personal lives is to translate to work. And so I definitely think that’s area of opportunity.
The other thing I see from sort of the generation, newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, course mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to understand the “why” behind things. And one of our communication is we never talk about the “what” without the “why.” I think there’s a desire to — the idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this what we’re going to do” or — that, I think, is moving away, and people, they don’t just want to do something because with formal authority told them to do it. They want do it because they understand why it matters, why it ties the mission. And I think that that forces leaders to really more of the “why” into how we communicate and motivate people.
So those are of the things I see, and then, you know, third I think is just flexibility. I think — and this true of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — think they’re looking for flexibility and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy and to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I and orient it more to agility. How can we have and principles and be committed to things, but also know to question, and when to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or understanding your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose or in terms benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs or processes you’ve in place that really speak to this big sea we’re seeing in terms of values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, course, it’s all about listening, right? And I think, many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand workforce is very similar: it’s Q and As and surveys, and things like that. And some of the things we’ve done, we have a people and culture NPS, net promoter score, same way we have for our users, for our internal teams. But I say one of the things that we’ve really tried to do appreciate that when we get inputs from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look the averages. You can’t look at it all in totality try and pull out an obvious “Oh, this is everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really dig into it and listen and do focus groups and talk to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I for us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a bunch of different listening mechanisms and resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is what everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still kind figuring it out, but I will tell you, some of things that we’ve heard from employees have changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or things like our approach to compensation or our approach to and I. So I think it’s more just like said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but treating everything as, like, an average or the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because we offices and teams in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re substantial, about the way we solve different things. And we used have a very, sort of, “One Vimeo” global approach in name of consistency and fairness, and what we found is have to be more localized. We really do. We to design mechanisms to support our teams in a different way, because their experiences and the world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely one, and I will tell you, it has involved a lot — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a lot of trying things, it not working, changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. I feel like every I know has a perspective on whether they do Q and A or anonymous Q and A, or real-time Q A. We’ve changed our approach there multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re figuring out the right way to listen and have dialogue with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on to the workplace for just another moment, because another thing hear from CEOs of my generation and older is concern about making sure that we are not just providing our employees with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, but also training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close proximity to mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for more years. What is your philosophy and take on making that knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s major challenge that I don’t know that everyone will of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. have a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have in over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. I’ve really realized the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and able to attract talent and just be more inclusive. On flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest folks that entering the workforce. So I think it’s a challenge. of the approaches that we’ve been taking, and what’s of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. So if my entire executive team is distributed, means I have to learn how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for whole set of new executives who have just joined. have sort of changed up the executive team almost entirely in the twelve months. So I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve to literally — we call it our operating system — we’ve to design an operating system, as an executive team, how we’re going to work together in that environment. How we share real-time feedback? How do we create the right loops? And so I think, from my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to it ourselves and model it and then, I think it’s a more proven for young people. I will say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration is really important learning. We do have — we bring people into an office. you’re remote, we ask folks to come in and spend time a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. I don’t they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an area that I don’t we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really that as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to get the growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, and it’s interesting — the tools you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation, video, can be really helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that really encouraged their young people to present, as a of having to go out and find the information need. And then, because we have video tools available to us now, you know, they have an opportunity share their ideas with a large group of people, first, kind of going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. In earlier comment, you talked a little bit about mental illness and the different things that people bringing to work, whether it is, you know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Matter protests, we had a lot of people coming to the office trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m if you can share a little bit about how you with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring whole selves to the office, which we encourage, sometimes, bring things, parts of themselves that are challenging.
AS: … I’ve always thought the responsibility of a leader is to people to do their best work and the responsibility of company is to empower our people to do their best work. so, of course, we have a real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like companies, the way we initially probably sought to do that more, you know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying to provide mental-health resources or support time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. I think that’s important. And I always say, to so many of managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have right people in place who care. At the same time, I will say we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, that that’s a reactive approach and actually the root cause — we can control at Vimeo — the root cause a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t have … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where we should spending more time — is how do we actually set the right prioritization and focus. There’s issue there, right? There’s a root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed because there’s much going on. I don’t feel equipped to solve it.” Then, we should into the “What is the detail there, and do need to do things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes Vimeo this year was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the starts to, maybe, move sideways, do you think that there are going to stakeholders who say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, workplace-as-a-family stuff. Where are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum has already pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software as a service, we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” know, pendulum swing. My perspective on this — and hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures results and treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get results. And so, you know, for me, I think what I observed over the last few years — that part, I think, hasn’t changed and shouldn’t change. were, I think, a lot of times when companies, did things because maybe it was lip service or we pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not what — ultimately, that’s what people need, in any case. So, you know, I of see it as — the way you channel you are caring towards your employees and how you empathetic, always should be in service of helping people their best work, which will deliver results, which will be for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that and if use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have been taking care of yourself during this period of tremendous turmoil and change, but growth? You mentioned you just had a baby. There’s a lot on shoulders. How, as a leader, do you practice some self-care or how do you make sure you’re getting the balance you need to be the effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the I use a lot to myself is “two things be true, both can be true.” I say this a lot. for me, I think of it as, like, “This is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public at the height the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine going through war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s an incredibly job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think me, it’s sort of acknowledging both of those things has helped me a lot. way I’ve tried to kind of lead, has been — it’s always been way, which is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo is is important and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy then I will — I can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy in team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at my career and actually, some my most fulfilling times in work were when — the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group people together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really part of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a little sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am fortunate. I think I have a great support network around and I do … My husband and I have a deal, where Sundays, I disappear for a couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk the city and I listen to my music and do I need to do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about how hybrid is going to look very different in the future than how we describe today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from a couple of other days. Tell us a little bit more about you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: I the idea of an office as a time and place completely away. And I think it’s really going to be people are going to want work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept where you’re located is going to change. And then the idea like “I’m going to work on this time zone” or “I’m going to attend this meeting that’s on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I think what you’re going find is more and more work, particularly from knowledge workers, is going be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration will happen asynchronously and will be using tools and technology — whether it’s video, whether it’s — to basically enable that at scale among many people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, are going to look different. Because I think it’s going to require — if you think about skill set to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus what that will now — I think in the future … the skill set is going to be like, “How do communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that provides and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, whether it’s compensation, whether it’s, know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. I think the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, it was time or place or budget, in some cases. And I think those constraints are going go away. And the promise is that if we are flexible and smart and we use in the right way, that we’ll actually come away a much evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of passion that you’ve talked about as being the thing gives you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. was great.