Stephanie Mehta: Welcome, Anjali. I’m so glad you’re here with today.
Anjali Sud: Thank you, it is great to be here.
SM: At Vimeo, you a workforce of 1,300 people worldwide — you have creatives, have finance people, you have technologists. So I’m going to with a really easy question: what was it like to manage this diverse workforce through a pandemic, a racial reckoning and a very fraught return office?
AS: Oh, it was a breeze, Stephanie. No, it was challenging. You know, I think the only constant has change. And as a leader, you obviously — you a workforce that’s looking for certainty, and they’re looking control what’s happening around them. And I think what we all found, as leaders, matter what company you were … responsible for, was that you couldn’t certainty, and you couldn’t always control the environment and things around you. And so, you know, for me, was really about agility. How do we stay flexible as a team? do we communicate in real time and keep people informed as we try and through things? And then, also just how do we with more humanity? You know, for Vimeo, one of the things I’ve learned over the last few years is we each the world so differently. We have employees who are remote. We have an incredible team in Ukraine … employees are on the front lines, who are literally at war. On the other hand, you have people different parts of the world who are experiencing mental-health challenges or burnout, and so I it was really just — the hardest part was not being able to give everyone certainty, not being able just apply a one-size-fits-all rule for everyone. But I think it forced us, as a company, to build more trust, because be agile and flexible, and to lead with humanity, you to trust each other. And so, I’m sort of that actually we’re emerging from this time with a culture that is more flexible and nimble, also, hopefully, has more trust.
SM: Can you give example of something that you put into place, perhaps the pandemic, to enhance communications or build trust or a greater sense of community or even to communicate there is no certainty, that is a muscle that you think you’ll continue to use the organization far into the future?
AS: There’s a couple of things that did. One — and we are a video platform, so I have to talk about video, but I mean this sincerely — one of hardest parts, when you’re all sort of disparate, is you lose context and you lose nuance you communicate. And we did make a concerted effort to away from email and chat, text-based communication, as much as possible, actually try, particularly for our leadership team, when we were communicating, to do with your face, and your hands and your body and your emotions. And we did through live streaming a lot of communications, recording a lot of videos. sent asynchronous video messages. So I send … I record screen and just send a note out to people. new hire does a video to welcome and introduce themselves. A lot of our meetings we’ve actually with just quick video presentations. And actually, what that really did was allow the humanity and the context come through and I think that helped us a to, kind of, stay close. So that was one, I think, really important thing.
Another thing is, I think, just creating mechanisms to make it to talk about when things aren’t working, because a critical of being agile is recognizing we have an area isn’t working. And so one of the things that do at Vimeo is we try — I do in all of my town halls, we do it in a of meetings — is always talk about what’s working, what our top three things, and what isn’t working — yet. we’ve kind of created, I think, a framework that sort of takes the stigma away from about what’s not working. And when you make that normalized and for people, I feel like it’s allowed us to be more open, as an organization, about what we need to change, what do we need to pivot. both of those, being more video-first in our communication and being more transparent and what’s not working, I think has been really helpful, and something we’re carrying forward.
SM: I love that advice about being video-first. So many of members of our workforce live in a video world. They’re used to video as means of communication. Which brings me to my next question. You’ve talked about the organization has changed. How do you see the changing? What is different with the young millennials, and even, now, the wave of Gen Z coming into the workplace?
AS: think it’s incredibly different. And, you know, one of the things that we about at Vimeo a lot is a lot of the mechanisms and communication modes that we use today, they’re really antiquated. They were designed for a totally different environment and totally different generation. But I see a lot of differences. of them, I think, is the line between your personal life work life is definitely blending. … If you think about your personal life — look TikTok. This generation is used to consuming content, learning, engaging, in a very way. And if they then have to come to work to be trained on a job, read a 300-page manual? Like, it’s going to happen, right? Or if you miss the meeting, and have to watch the Zoom recording of a three-hour meeting — that’s just not to happen. And so I think that there is definitely sort this — you know, we talk about the “consumerization of enterprise.” Those are just fancy words saying the way … we communicate and interact in personal lives is going to translate to work. And so I think that’s an area of opportunity.
The other thing I from sort of the generation, the newest generation coming into the workforce, is sort of, of mission-driven, but I think there’s a desire to really understand the “why” behind things. And one of our mantras is we never talk about the “what” without “why.” And I think there’s a desire to — idea that, well, there’s a hierarchy, or “My boss told me that this is what we’re going do” or — that, I think, is increasingly moving away, and people, they don’t want to do something because someone with formal authority told to do it. They want to do it because understand why it matters, why it ties to the mission. And I that that forces leaders to really bring more of the “why” into we communicate and motivate people.
So those are two of things I see, and then, you know, the third think is just flexibility. I think — and this is of all of us, but particularly the younger generation — I think they’re looking for and they want options and choices. And it’s not always easy feasible to provide ultimate flexibility, but this is where I try and orient it to agility. How can we have approaches and principles and committed to things, but also know when to question, and to actually pivot?
SM: Yeah. Anjali, can you share a few examples of ways that at Vimeo have tried to really be proactive when it comes to addressing or what your next generation of employees are going to want, either in terms of purpose in terms of benefits or in terms of flexibility? Are there programs processes you’ve put in place that really speak to this big sea change we’re seeing in terms values from the workforce?
AS: Firstly, of course, it’s all about listening, right? I think, like many organizations, the way we’ve tried to listen and understand our is very similar: it’s Q and As and engagement surveys, things like that. And some of the things that we’ve done, we have people and culture NPS, net promoter score, the same way have for our users, for our internal teams. But I would say one of things that we’ve really tried to do is appreciate that when we get from our employees, 1,300 employees … you can’t look at averages. You can’t look at it all in totality and try and out an obvious “Oh, this is how everybody’s feeling.” Because what you actually — when you really into it and truly listen and do focus groups and to people — what you’ll find is actually there’s very experiences and desires among your employees. And so, I think us, what we’ve really just tried to do is have a of different listening mechanisms and then resist the urge to conveniently pull, like, “Oh, this is everyone’s feeling, let’s just do this thing as the action.” And it’s hard, and we’re still of figuring it out, but I will tell you, some of the things that we’ve heard from employees changed our approach to hybrid work or travel or even things like our approach to compensation or our to DE and I. So I think it’s more just I said, that agile listening, constantly really understanding what’s happening, but not treating everything as, like, an average the same. And for us, it’s been particularly stark because we have offices teams in so many different countries and the differences, they’re substantial. They’re really substantial, the way we solve different things. And we used to have a very, of, “One Vimeo” global approach in the name of consistency fairness, and what we found is we have to be localized. We really do. We have to design mechanisms support our teams in a very different way, because their experiences and world around them is quite different.
So I think that’s definitely been one, and I will tell you, has involved a lot of — as an executive team and leadership team — it’s involved a of trying things, it not working, and changing them. And a great example is our Q and A. feel like every leader I know has a perspective on they do open Q and A or anonymous Q A, or real-time Q and A. We’ve changed our there multiple times, and I know we will again, because we’re still out the right way to listen and have a with a very diverse workforce.
SM: I want to stay on newcomers the workplace for just another moment, because another thing I from CEOs of my generation and older is a about making sure that we are not just providing our youngest with the flexibility and the purpose that they need, also the training and the wisdom that comes, oftentimes, from being in close to a mentor or to somebody who’s done the job for many years. What is your philosophy and take on making sure knowledge transfer is happening?
AS: I think it’s a major challenge that I don’t know everyone will sort of have a solution for. I think about that all the time. We a very distributed workforce at Vimeo. We have people over eight countries. My executive team is entirely distributed. So I’ve really the benefits of being able to have a distributed workforce and being able to attract and just be more inclusive. On the flip side, there’s definitely, I think, a lack of the same of learning opportunities and mentorship, particularly for the youngest that are entering the workforce. So I think it’s challenge. One of the approaches that we’ve been taking, what’s sort of nice, is we’re modeling it at the top. if my entire executive team is distributed, that means I have to how to provide real-time feedback, mentorship and development for a set of new executives who have just joined. We have of changed up the executive team almost entirely in the last twelve months. I’ve had to deal with the same challenges. And we’ve had to literally — we call it our system — we’ve had to design an operating system, an executive team, for how we’re going to work in that environment. How do we share real-time feedback? How we create the right communication loops? And so I think, my perspective, it’s more we have to be able to do it and model it and then, I think it’s a more proven mechanism for young people. will say, like many companies … I do believe that in-person collaboration really important for learning. We do have — we bring into an office. If you’re remote, we ask folks to come in spend time in a room with their team, do social activities, all of those things. don’t think they will go away, nor do I think they should. But, you know, candidly, it’s an that I don’t think we’ve really figured out perfectly and I think it’s really critical as leaders, we do that, so that this next generation is able to get same growth opportunities that we all had.
SM: Well, it’s interesting — the tools that you mentioned at very beginning of our conversation, around video, can be helpful there. I’ve heard of a number of organizations that have really their young people to present, as a way of to go out and find the information they need. And then, because have video tools available to us now, you know, they have an to share their ideas with a large group of people, but first, kind going through the fact-finding and the research, and then sharing their ideas. an earlier comment, you talked a little bit about illness and the different things that people are bringing to work, whether it is, know, exhaustion, burnout. During the Black Lives Matter protests, we had a lot of coming to the office feeling trauma, and feeling really personal issues bubble to the surface. I’m if you can share a little bit about how you with this increasing personal — you know, when people bring their whole selves the office, which we encourage, sometimes, they bring things, parts themselves that are challenging.
AS: Yeah … I’ve always thought the responsibility of leader is to empower people to do their best work the responsibility of a company is to empower our to do their best work. And so, of course, we a real role to play in supporting things like mental-health issues burnout. And, you know, the way I think, like many companies, way we initially probably sought to do that was more, know, you’re seeing a problem and you’re reacting by trying provide mental-health resources or support or time off. And, I think — and empathy, just empathy. I that’s really important. And I always say, to so of our managers … just care. If we just care, a lot of things easier. You don’t have to design a hundred mechanisms if you just have the right people in who care. At the same time, I will say we’re realizing now, in sort of this next phase, is that that’s reactive approach and actually the root cause — that we can control at — the root cause of a lot of stress and burnout is sometimes people either don’t enough … focus, we’re asking people to do too many things or they don’t feel like they’re supported in those things. And that, I think, is actually where should be spending more time — is how do we actually set the prioritization and focus. There’s some issue there, right? There’s root cause there that’s a “Oh, I feel like I’m stressed there’s too much going on. I don’t feel equipped to it.” Then, we should get into the “What is the detail there, and do we need to things differently?” And, you know, one of our themes at Vimeo this was “Do less, better.”
SM: As the economy starts to, maybe, sideways, do you think that there are going to be stakeholders say, you know, “Out with all of this touchy-feely, the workplace-as-a-family stuff. are my results?”
AS: Absolutely. I think the pendulum already swung pretty clearly. I mean, I work in SAS, software a service, so we already went from “growth at all cost” to “profitability,” you know, pendulum swing. perspective on this — and it hasn’t changed — I think the best leaders and cultures deliver results treat people well. And I actually think, if you people well, with kindness and empathy, you will get better results. And so, you know, for me, think what I observed over the last few years is — that part, I think, hasn’t changed shouldn’t change. There were, I think, a lot of when companies, we did things because maybe it was lip service we felt pressured. And that’s not going to be sustainable. But that’s not — ultimately, that’s not what people need, in any case. So, know, I sort of see it as — the way channel how you are caring towards your employees and how you empathetic, always should be in service of helping people their best work, which will deliver results, which will good for the bottom line. And you have to believe that. You have to be committed to that if you use that consistently in your decision-making, it should not a trade-off. These are not mutually exclusive things.
SM: Anjali, how have been taking care of yourself during this period of turmoil and change, but also growth? You mentioned you had a baby. There’s a lot on your shoulders. How, as leader, do you practice some self-care or how do make sure that you’re getting the balance you need be the most effective leader you can be?
AS: I think — recently, the I use a lot to myself is “two things can be true, both can true.” I say this a lot. And for me, think of it as, like, “This job is hard, and it’s gotten harder.” We went public the height of the pandemic and last year, market volatility has been tremendous. You know, we’re obviously going a ton with post-pandemic, we have a team in Ukraine through a war — all these things that have happened. And so, it’s a hard job, and it’s incredibly privileged job. It’s a gift, right? And so, I think for me, it’s sort of both of those things has helped me a lot. The way I’ve to kind of lead, has been — it’s always this way, which is, for me, it’s I have to have passion. have to have passion. I have to believe so deeply that what Vimeo doing is important and matters for the world. And if I have passion, I have energy and then will — I can kind of move through anything. I have to find joy my team. I feel like, especially in hard times, I look back at career and actually, some of my most fulfilling times in work were when — the hardest business situations. But it’s because it brought a group people together all on one team, and so I think that’s been, you know, a really big of it. And then, yeah, like, you have to be a selfish sometimes, and take care of yourself. And I am really fortunate. think I have a great support network around me and do … My husband and I have a deal, where on Sundays, I disappear for couple of hours. I just disappear and I walk around the and I listen to my music and do whatever I need do, and that’s really important.
SM: So you talked about hybrid work is going to look very different in the future than we describe it today. It’s basically in office a couple of days, work from a couple of other days. Tell us a little more about what you could potentially see that evolving into.
AS: think the idea of an office as a time place completely goes away. And I think it’s really going to be people going to want to work from anywhere, anywhere in the world. Even the concept of where you’re located is to change. And then the idea of like “I’m going work on this time zone” or “I’m going to this meeting that’s scheduled on this date” — I think that’s going to go away. And I what you’re going to find is more and more work, particularly knowledge workers, is going to be done anywhere, anytime. Communication and collaboration happen asynchronously and we will be using tools and — whether it’s video, whether it’s AI — to basically enable that at scale among people, anywhere in the world. And then I think leadership, are going to look different. Because I think it’s to require — if you think about the skill to be a global CEO 30 years ago versus that will require now — I think in the … the skill set is going to be like, “How you communicate with diverse, global audiences and employees across time zones in a way that is effective, that context and alignment at scale? How do you organize programs, it’s compensation, whether it’s, you know, training?” All of that is going to look very different. But I the ultimate thing you’ll see is just … there were these constraints that we’ve lived with, whether was time or place or budget, in some cases. I think those constraints are going to go away. the promise is that if we are flexible and smart we use technology in the right way, that we’ll actually come away a more evolved and efficient workforce.
SM: Well, I think you just showed us some of the that you’ve talked about as being the thing that gives you energy to lead that organization of 1,300 worldwide. Anjali, thank you so much for being here today.
AS: Thank you. This great.